Which “exotic salt” can lower water's freezing point by –70 °C?When it rains, it puddles. Spilled salt cycles between wet and dry with humidity. Is this akin to a phase change?How can melting point equal freezing point?What non-toxic non-water substances have a freezing point very close to water's?Propose a chemical formula for the white solid that forms during the initial stages of the reaction of Sn with benzyl chlorideHow can water exist in three states in freezing point?How to determine which aqueous solution has the largest freezing point depressionCan any solute be used to lower the freezing point of water?Does this freezing point depression problem make sense?Freezing point of oxygen-18 waterDepression of freezing pointFreezing point depression of salt solutions

Sparring against two opponents test

Is Iron Man stronger than the Hulk?

Counting the Number of Real Roots of A Polynomial

In "Avengers: Endgame", what does this name refer to?

Is throwing dice a stochastic or a deterministic process?

How to remap repeating commands i.e. <number><command>?

Is 'contemporary' ambiguous and if so is there a better word?

Clarification of algebra in moment generating functions

Is space itself expanding or is it just momentum from the big bang carrying things apart?

Looking for sci-fi book based on Hinduism/Buddhism

Dangerous workplace travelling

Simple Derivative Proof?

Is there precedent or are there procedures for a US president refusing to concede to an electoral defeat?

Constitutional limitation of criminalizing behavior in US law?

Has the United States ever had a non-Christian President?

Which US defense organization would respond to an invasion like this?

Why didn't this character get a funeral at the end of Avengers: Endgame?

As black, how should one respond to 4. Qe2 by white in the Russian Game, Damiano Variation?

Would a "Permanence" spell in 5e be overpowered?

All superlinear runtime algorithms are asymptotically equivalent to convex function?

How to pass hash as password to ssh server

Why would one crossvalidate the random state number?

Does running exec do anything?

Execute command on shell command output



Which “exotic salt” can lower water's freezing point by –70 °C?


When it rains, it puddles. Spilled salt cycles between wet and dry with humidity. Is this akin to a phase change?How can melting point equal freezing point?What non-toxic non-water substances have a freezing point very close to water's?Propose a chemical formula for the white solid that forms during the initial stages of the reaction of Sn with benzyl chlorideHow can water exist in three states in freezing point?How to determine which aqueous solution has the largest freezing point depressionCan any solute be used to lower the freezing point of water?Does this freezing point depression problem make sense?Freezing point of oxygen-18 waterDepression of freezing pointFreezing point depression of salt solutions













4












$begingroup$


The Medium.com article Mars Phoenix Lander, 10 Years Later shows several remarkable images and discoveries on Mars by the Mars Phoenix Lander circa 2008.



One image (shown below) shows what looks like droplets of liquid water, condensed on the surface of one of the lander's legs.



The article says (emphasis mine):




Shortly after landing, the camera on Phoenix’s robotic arm captured views of blobs of material on one of the landing struts. Over time, these blobs moved, darkened, and coalesced, behaving like droplets of liquid water. The hypothesis here was that these blobs “splashed up” on the struts when the descent thrusters melted the ice exposed upon landing mentioned above.



But if liquid water isn’t stable on the martian surface, how did Phoenix observe liquid water on Mars? The key here lies in salt. If you live anywhere that gets snow, you’re probably familiar with salt as a de-icer for roads, sidewalks, etc. Salt lowers the freezing point of water, allowing it to remain liquid at temperatures lower than that of non-salty water. For example, pure water freezes at 0 °C/32 °F, but ocean saltwater freezes around −2 °C/28.4 °F. While the de-icing salts you get at the hardware store lower the freezing point by a few degrees, more exotic salts can lower the freezing point as much as −70 °C/−89 °F! Phoenix discovered some of these exotic salts in the soil around the lander—in particular, magnesium perchlorate. (note, minor editorial changes have been made)





Question: Which "exotic salt" can lower water's freezing point by −70 °C?



Is it in fact magnesium perchlorate (which was found on Mars) or is it a different salt?




enter image description here




Blobs of possible brine (really salty water) imaged on one of Phoenix’s landing struts shortly after arriving on Mars. Credit: NASA/JPL-Caltech/University of Arizona/Max Planck Institute











share|improve this question











$endgroup$







  • 2




    $begingroup$
    You know why freezing point of water is decreased by using salt? It is because of relative lowering in vapour pressure which depends on number of particles present in solution, it doesn't matter whatever sizes are or whatever the salt is, the necessary conditions are that the substance you are mixing must be non volatile and it must be a solution. So basically the more salt you mix the lower the freezing point is but there is a limit on how much you can mix salt in water. And freezing point is decreased by a few degrees only. -70° is like a dream. the text you are reading might be wrong.
    $endgroup$
    – Saurav Singh
    1 hour ago










  • $begingroup$
    Also -70 C seems awful cold for a super cooled liquid.
    $endgroup$
    – MaxW
    1 hour ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    @SauravSingh, vapor pressure has nothing to do with freezing point, though it does affect the boiling point.
    $endgroup$
    – DrMoishe Pippik
    53 mins ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @andselisk the information within the quote might be (infinitesimally) more accurate, but it becomes a less accurate quote. I think altering text and presenting it as a quote without making note that it's been altered is a slippery slope. In the case of the block quote, you did not edit my post, you revised a third party's work.
    $endgroup$
    – uhoh
    16 mins ago







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @andselisk I'm saying that the deed itself is inappropriate. I recommend you do not alter quoted text anywhere in Stack Exchange without making note of it at the site of the quote itself, where the reader notices it.
    $endgroup$
    – uhoh
    11 mins ago
















4












$begingroup$


The Medium.com article Mars Phoenix Lander, 10 Years Later shows several remarkable images and discoveries on Mars by the Mars Phoenix Lander circa 2008.



One image (shown below) shows what looks like droplets of liquid water, condensed on the surface of one of the lander's legs.



The article says (emphasis mine):




Shortly after landing, the camera on Phoenix’s robotic arm captured views of blobs of material on one of the landing struts. Over time, these blobs moved, darkened, and coalesced, behaving like droplets of liquid water. The hypothesis here was that these blobs “splashed up” on the struts when the descent thrusters melted the ice exposed upon landing mentioned above.



But if liquid water isn’t stable on the martian surface, how did Phoenix observe liquid water on Mars? The key here lies in salt. If you live anywhere that gets snow, you’re probably familiar with salt as a de-icer for roads, sidewalks, etc. Salt lowers the freezing point of water, allowing it to remain liquid at temperatures lower than that of non-salty water. For example, pure water freezes at 0 °C/32 °F, but ocean saltwater freezes around −2 °C/28.4 °F. While the de-icing salts you get at the hardware store lower the freezing point by a few degrees, more exotic salts can lower the freezing point as much as −70 °C/−89 °F! Phoenix discovered some of these exotic salts in the soil around the lander—in particular, magnesium perchlorate. (note, minor editorial changes have been made)





Question: Which "exotic salt" can lower water's freezing point by −70 °C?



Is it in fact magnesium perchlorate (which was found on Mars) or is it a different salt?




enter image description here




Blobs of possible brine (really salty water) imaged on one of Phoenix’s landing struts shortly after arriving on Mars. Credit: NASA/JPL-Caltech/University of Arizona/Max Planck Institute











share|improve this question











$endgroup$







  • 2




    $begingroup$
    You know why freezing point of water is decreased by using salt? It is because of relative lowering in vapour pressure which depends on number of particles present in solution, it doesn't matter whatever sizes are or whatever the salt is, the necessary conditions are that the substance you are mixing must be non volatile and it must be a solution. So basically the more salt you mix the lower the freezing point is but there is a limit on how much you can mix salt in water. And freezing point is decreased by a few degrees only. -70° is like a dream. the text you are reading might be wrong.
    $endgroup$
    – Saurav Singh
    1 hour ago










  • $begingroup$
    Also -70 C seems awful cold for a super cooled liquid.
    $endgroup$
    – MaxW
    1 hour ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    @SauravSingh, vapor pressure has nothing to do with freezing point, though it does affect the boiling point.
    $endgroup$
    – DrMoishe Pippik
    53 mins ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @andselisk the information within the quote might be (infinitesimally) more accurate, but it becomes a less accurate quote. I think altering text and presenting it as a quote without making note that it's been altered is a slippery slope. In the case of the block quote, you did not edit my post, you revised a third party's work.
    $endgroup$
    – uhoh
    16 mins ago







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @andselisk I'm saying that the deed itself is inappropriate. I recommend you do not alter quoted text anywhere in Stack Exchange without making note of it at the site of the quote itself, where the reader notices it.
    $endgroup$
    – uhoh
    11 mins ago














4












4








4


0



$begingroup$


The Medium.com article Mars Phoenix Lander, 10 Years Later shows several remarkable images and discoveries on Mars by the Mars Phoenix Lander circa 2008.



One image (shown below) shows what looks like droplets of liquid water, condensed on the surface of one of the lander's legs.



The article says (emphasis mine):




Shortly after landing, the camera on Phoenix’s robotic arm captured views of blobs of material on one of the landing struts. Over time, these blobs moved, darkened, and coalesced, behaving like droplets of liquid water. The hypothesis here was that these blobs “splashed up” on the struts when the descent thrusters melted the ice exposed upon landing mentioned above.



But if liquid water isn’t stable on the martian surface, how did Phoenix observe liquid water on Mars? The key here lies in salt. If you live anywhere that gets snow, you’re probably familiar with salt as a de-icer for roads, sidewalks, etc. Salt lowers the freezing point of water, allowing it to remain liquid at temperatures lower than that of non-salty water. For example, pure water freezes at 0 °C/32 °F, but ocean saltwater freezes around −2 °C/28.4 °F. While the de-icing salts you get at the hardware store lower the freezing point by a few degrees, more exotic salts can lower the freezing point as much as −70 °C/−89 °F! Phoenix discovered some of these exotic salts in the soil around the lander—in particular, magnesium perchlorate. (note, minor editorial changes have been made)





Question: Which "exotic salt" can lower water's freezing point by −70 °C?



Is it in fact magnesium perchlorate (which was found on Mars) or is it a different salt?




enter image description here




Blobs of possible brine (really salty water) imaged on one of Phoenix’s landing struts shortly after arriving on Mars. Credit: NASA/JPL-Caltech/University of Arizona/Max Planck Institute











share|improve this question











$endgroup$




The Medium.com article Mars Phoenix Lander, 10 Years Later shows several remarkable images and discoveries on Mars by the Mars Phoenix Lander circa 2008.



One image (shown below) shows what looks like droplets of liquid water, condensed on the surface of one of the lander's legs.



The article says (emphasis mine):




Shortly after landing, the camera on Phoenix’s robotic arm captured views of blobs of material on one of the landing struts. Over time, these blobs moved, darkened, and coalesced, behaving like droplets of liquid water. The hypothesis here was that these blobs “splashed up” on the struts when the descent thrusters melted the ice exposed upon landing mentioned above.



But if liquid water isn’t stable on the martian surface, how did Phoenix observe liquid water on Mars? The key here lies in salt. If you live anywhere that gets snow, you’re probably familiar with salt as a de-icer for roads, sidewalks, etc. Salt lowers the freezing point of water, allowing it to remain liquid at temperatures lower than that of non-salty water. For example, pure water freezes at 0 °C/32 °F, but ocean saltwater freezes around −2 °C/28.4 °F. While the de-icing salts you get at the hardware store lower the freezing point by a few degrees, more exotic salts can lower the freezing point as much as −70 °C/−89 °F! Phoenix discovered some of these exotic salts in the soil around the lander—in particular, magnesium perchlorate. (note, minor editorial changes have been made)





Question: Which "exotic salt" can lower water's freezing point by −70 °C?



Is it in fact magnesium perchlorate (which was found on Mars) or is it a different salt?




enter image description here




Blobs of possible brine (really salty water) imaged on one of Phoenix’s landing struts shortly after arriving on Mars. Credit: NASA/JPL-Caltech/University of Arizona/Max Planck Institute








inorganic-chemistry aqueous-solution phase






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited 19 mins ago









andselisk

20.4k669133




20.4k669133










asked 2 hours ago









uhohuhoh

2,1261246




2,1261246







  • 2




    $begingroup$
    You know why freezing point of water is decreased by using salt? It is because of relative lowering in vapour pressure which depends on number of particles present in solution, it doesn't matter whatever sizes are or whatever the salt is, the necessary conditions are that the substance you are mixing must be non volatile and it must be a solution. So basically the more salt you mix the lower the freezing point is but there is a limit on how much you can mix salt in water. And freezing point is decreased by a few degrees only. -70° is like a dream. the text you are reading might be wrong.
    $endgroup$
    – Saurav Singh
    1 hour ago










  • $begingroup$
    Also -70 C seems awful cold for a super cooled liquid.
    $endgroup$
    – MaxW
    1 hour ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    @SauravSingh, vapor pressure has nothing to do with freezing point, though it does affect the boiling point.
    $endgroup$
    – DrMoishe Pippik
    53 mins ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @andselisk the information within the quote might be (infinitesimally) more accurate, but it becomes a less accurate quote. I think altering text and presenting it as a quote without making note that it's been altered is a slippery slope. In the case of the block quote, you did not edit my post, you revised a third party's work.
    $endgroup$
    – uhoh
    16 mins ago







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @andselisk I'm saying that the deed itself is inappropriate. I recommend you do not alter quoted text anywhere in Stack Exchange without making note of it at the site of the quote itself, where the reader notices it.
    $endgroup$
    – uhoh
    11 mins ago













  • 2




    $begingroup$
    You know why freezing point of water is decreased by using salt? It is because of relative lowering in vapour pressure which depends on number of particles present in solution, it doesn't matter whatever sizes are or whatever the salt is, the necessary conditions are that the substance you are mixing must be non volatile and it must be a solution. So basically the more salt you mix the lower the freezing point is but there is a limit on how much you can mix salt in water. And freezing point is decreased by a few degrees only. -70° is like a dream. the text you are reading might be wrong.
    $endgroup$
    – Saurav Singh
    1 hour ago










  • $begingroup$
    Also -70 C seems awful cold for a super cooled liquid.
    $endgroup$
    – MaxW
    1 hour ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    @SauravSingh, vapor pressure has nothing to do with freezing point, though it does affect the boiling point.
    $endgroup$
    – DrMoishe Pippik
    53 mins ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @andselisk the information within the quote might be (infinitesimally) more accurate, but it becomes a less accurate quote. I think altering text and presenting it as a quote without making note that it's been altered is a slippery slope. In the case of the block quote, you did not edit my post, you revised a third party's work.
    $endgroup$
    – uhoh
    16 mins ago







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @andselisk I'm saying that the deed itself is inappropriate. I recommend you do not alter quoted text anywhere in Stack Exchange without making note of it at the site of the quote itself, where the reader notices it.
    $endgroup$
    – uhoh
    11 mins ago








2




2




$begingroup$
You know why freezing point of water is decreased by using salt? It is because of relative lowering in vapour pressure which depends on number of particles present in solution, it doesn't matter whatever sizes are or whatever the salt is, the necessary conditions are that the substance you are mixing must be non volatile and it must be a solution. So basically the more salt you mix the lower the freezing point is but there is a limit on how much you can mix salt in water. And freezing point is decreased by a few degrees only. -70° is like a dream. the text you are reading might be wrong.
$endgroup$
– Saurav Singh
1 hour ago




$begingroup$
You know why freezing point of water is decreased by using salt? It is because of relative lowering in vapour pressure which depends on number of particles present in solution, it doesn't matter whatever sizes are or whatever the salt is, the necessary conditions are that the substance you are mixing must be non volatile and it must be a solution. So basically the more salt you mix the lower the freezing point is but there is a limit on how much you can mix salt in water. And freezing point is decreased by a few degrees only. -70° is like a dream. the text you are reading might be wrong.
$endgroup$
– Saurav Singh
1 hour ago












$begingroup$
Also -70 C seems awful cold for a super cooled liquid.
$endgroup$
– MaxW
1 hour ago




$begingroup$
Also -70 C seems awful cold for a super cooled liquid.
$endgroup$
– MaxW
1 hour ago




2




2




$begingroup$
@SauravSingh, vapor pressure has nothing to do with freezing point, though it does affect the boiling point.
$endgroup$
– DrMoishe Pippik
53 mins ago




$begingroup$
@SauravSingh, vapor pressure has nothing to do with freezing point, though it does affect the boiling point.
$endgroup$
– DrMoishe Pippik
53 mins ago




1




1




$begingroup$
@andselisk the information within the quote might be (infinitesimally) more accurate, but it becomes a less accurate quote. I think altering text and presenting it as a quote without making note that it's been altered is a slippery slope. In the case of the block quote, you did not edit my post, you revised a third party's work.
$endgroup$
– uhoh
16 mins ago





$begingroup$
@andselisk the information within the quote might be (infinitesimally) more accurate, but it becomes a less accurate quote. I think altering text and presenting it as a quote without making note that it's been altered is a slippery slope. In the case of the block quote, you did not edit my post, you revised a third party's work.
$endgroup$
– uhoh
16 mins ago





1




1




$begingroup$
@andselisk I'm saying that the deed itself is inappropriate. I recommend you do not alter quoted text anywhere in Stack Exchange without making note of it at the site of the quote itself, where the reader notices it.
$endgroup$
– uhoh
11 mins ago





$begingroup$
@andselisk I'm saying that the deed itself is inappropriate. I recommend you do not alter quoted text anywhere in Stack Exchange without making note of it at the site of the quote itself, where the reader notices it.
$endgroup$
– uhoh
11 mins ago











2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















4












$begingroup$

I recently got a chance to attend a talk by someone who was working on developing analytical instrumentation on Mars. The interesting story is that the initial results by ion-selective electrode was that Mars soil is full of nitrates. Nobody knew on Earth that the nitrate ion selective electrode is far more responsive to perchlorate than nitrate. After learning this, it was an eye opener for analytical chemists! Now they wish to use chromatography rather than electrochemistry. So this was a good lesson for us on Earth.



Now that they know it is a perchlorate ion, people did some studies on supercooled brines. See this paper: The formation of supercooled brines, viscous liquids, and low-temperature perchlorate glasses in aqueous solutions relevant to Mars J.D. Toner, D.C. Catling, and B. Light, Icarus, 233, 1 May 2014, pp 36-47 (also available here). They clearly show that if calcium or magnesium perchlorates are slowly cooled, one can get supercooled brines up to -120 Celcius. This is a rather amazing finding. They call it a glassy state.






share|improve this answer











$endgroup$












  • $begingroup$
    "Nobody knew on Earth" (!!) Let's add this to the list of "Reasons to go to Mars" ;-)
    $endgroup$
    – uhoh
    46 mins ago







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Yes it was a surprising finding because everyone used nitrate selective electrodes without ever realizing that it also responds to perchlorate far more effectively.
    $endgroup$
    – M. Farooq
    43 mins ago


















0












$begingroup$


Your Question: Which "exotic salt" can lower water's freezing point by $pu-70 ^circ C$?




Here is your "exotic compound" although it is not a salt by definition. It is a base: Aqua ammonia, also called ammoniacal liquor, ammonia liquor, or ammonia water, is produced by dissolving ammonia gas ($ceNH3$) in water. The proper chemical name of aqua ammonia is ammonium hydroxide ($ceNH4OH$), which is in following equilibrium with water:
$$ceNH3 + H2O <=> NH4+ + OH-$$



Ammonia is very soluble in water: According to Wikipedia, its solubility in water is $47% (w/w)$ at $pu0 ^circ C$, $31% (w/w)$ at $pu25 ^circ C$, and $18% (w/w)$ at $pu50 ^circ C$. Therefore it is ideal to cause large freezing point depression since its solubility increases with decreasing temperature. Now, let's see how are the freezing points of aqua ammonia solutions behave with increasing concentrations. The large scale manufacturer of aqua ammonia, Tanner Industries, listed following values of boiling and freezing points of various solutions in its Customer Manual:



$$
beginarrayccc \hline
% ceNH3 text (by weight) & textApprox. Boiling point & text Approx. Freezing point \hline
23.52 & pu103 ^circ F: (pu39.4 ^circ C) & pu-56 ^circ F: ( pu-48.9 ^circ C)\
25.48 & pu95 ^circ F: (pu35.0 ^circ C) & pu-69 ^circ F : ( pu-56.1 ^circ C)\
27.44 & pu88 ^circ F : (pu31.1 ^circ C) & pu-89 ^circ F: ( pu-67.2 ^circ C)\
29.40 & pu85 ^circ F: (pu29.4 ^circ C) & pu-110 ^circ F : ( pu-78.9 ^circ C)\
31.36 & pu73 ^circ F: (pu22.8 ^circ C) & pu-123 ^circ F : ( pu-86.1 ^circ C)\
33.32 & pu66 ^circ F : (pu18.9 ^circ C) & pu-148 ^circ F: ( pu-100 ^circ C)\hline
endarray
$$



Accordingly, anything between $29-33%$ of aqua ammonia solution would do the job.





share









$endgroup$













    Your Answer








    StackExchange.ready(function()
    var channelOptions =
    tags: "".split(" "),
    id: "431"
    ;
    initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

    StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function()
    // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
    if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled)
    StackExchange.using("snippets", function()
    createEditor();
    );

    else
    createEditor();

    );

    function createEditor()
    StackExchange.prepareEditor(
    heartbeatType: 'answer',
    autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
    convertImagesToLinks: false,
    noModals: true,
    showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
    reputationToPostImages: null,
    bindNavPrevention: true,
    postfix: "",
    imageUploader:
    brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
    contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
    allowUrls: true
    ,
    onDemand: true,
    discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
    ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
    );



    );













    draft saved

    draft discarded


















    StackExchange.ready(
    function ()
    StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fchemistry.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f114837%2fwhich-exotic-salt-can-lower-waters-freezing-point-by-70-c%23new-answer', 'question_page');

    );

    Post as a guest















    Required, but never shown

























    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

    votes








    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes









    4












    $begingroup$

    I recently got a chance to attend a talk by someone who was working on developing analytical instrumentation on Mars. The interesting story is that the initial results by ion-selective electrode was that Mars soil is full of nitrates. Nobody knew on Earth that the nitrate ion selective electrode is far more responsive to perchlorate than nitrate. After learning this, it was an eye opener for analytical chemists! Now they wish to use chromatography rather than electrochemistry. So this was a good lesson for us on Earth.



    Now that they know it is a perchlorate ion, people did some studies on supercooled brines. See this paper: The formation of supercooled brines, viscous liquids, and low-temperature perchlorate glasses in aqueous solutions relevant to Mars J.D. Toner, D.C. Catling, and B. Light, Icarus, 233, 1 May 2014, pp 36-47 (also available here). They clearly show that if calcium or magnesium perchlorates are slowly cooled, one can get supercooled brines up to -120 Celcius. This is a rather amazing finding. They call it a glassy state.






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$












    • $begingroup$
      "Nobody knew on Earth" (!!) Let's add this to the list of "Reasons to go to Mars" ;-)
      $endgroup$
      – uhoh
      46 mins ago







    • 1




      $begingroup$
      Yes it was a surprising finding because everyone used nitrate selective electrodes without ever realizing that it also responds to perchlorate far more effectively.
      $endgroup$
      – M. Farooq
      43 mins ago















    4












    $begingroup$

    I recently got a chance to attend a talk by someone who was working on developing analytical instrumentation on Mars. The interesting story is that the initial results by ion-selective electrode was that Mars soil is full of nitrates. Nobody knew on Earth that the nitrate ion selective electrode is far more responsive to perchlorate than nitrate. After learning this, it was an eye opener for analytical chemists! Now they wish to use chromatography rather than electrochemistry. So this was a good lesson for us on Earth.



    Now that they know it is a perchlorate ion, people did some studies on supercooled brines. See this paper: The formation of supercooled brines, viscous liquids, and low-temperature perchlorate glasses in aqueous solutions relevant to Mars J.D. Toner, D.C. Catling, and B. Light, Icarus, 233, 1 May 2014, pp 36-47 (also available here). They clearly show that if calcium or magnesium perchlorates are slowly cooled, one can get supercooled brines up to -120 Celcius. This is a rather amazing finding. They call it a glassy state.






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$












    • $begingroup$
      "Nobody knew on Earth" (!!) Let's add this to the list of "Reasons to go to Mars" ;-)
      $endgroup$
      – uhoh
      46 mins ago







    • 1




      $begingroup$
      Yes it was a surprising finding because everyone used nitrate selective electrodes without ever realizing that it also responds to perchlorate far more effectively.
      $endgroup$
      – M. Farooq
      43 mins ago













    4












    4








    4





    $begingroup$

    I recently got a chance to attend a talk by someone who was working on developing analytical instrumentation on Mars. The interesting story is that the initial results by ion-selective electrode was that Mars soil is full of nitrates. Nobody knew on Earth that the nitrate ion selective electrode is far more responsive to perchlorate than nitrate. After learning this, it was an eye opener for analytical chemists! Now they wish to use chromatography rather than electrochemistry. So this was a good lesson for us on Earth.



    Now that they know it is a perchlorate ion, people did some studies on supercooled brines. See this paper: The formation of supercooled brines, viscous liquids, and low-temperature perchlorate glasses in aqueous solutions relevant to Mars J.D. Toner, D.C. Catling, and B. Light, Icarus, 233, 1 May 2014, pp 36-47 (also available here). They clearly show that if calcium or magnesium perchlorates are slowly cooled, one can get supercooled brines up to -120 Celcius. This is a rather amazing finding. They call it a glassy state.






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$



    I recently got a chance to attend a talk by someone who was working on developing analytical instrumentation on Mars. The interesting story is that the initial results by ion-selective electrode was that Mars soil is full of nitrates. Nobody knew on Earth that the nitrate ion selective electrode is far more responsive to perchlorate than nitrate. After learning this, it was an eye opener for analytical chemists! Now they wish to use chromatography rather than electrochemistry. So this was a good lesson for us on Earth.



    Now that they know it is a perchlorate ion, people did some studies on supercooled brines. See this paper: The formation of supercooled brines, viscous liquids, and low-temperature perchlorate glasses in aqueous solutions relevant to Mars J.D. Toner, D.C. Catling, and B. Light, Icarus, 233, 1 May 2014, pp 36-47 (also available here). They clearly show that if calcium or magnesium perchlorates are slowly cooled, one can get supercooled brines up to -120 Celcius. This is a rather amazing finding. They call it a glassy state.







    share|improve this answer














    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer








    edited 4 mins ago

























    answered 46 mins ago









    M. FarooqM. Farooq

    2,380113




    2,380113











    • $begingroup$
      "Nobody knew on Earth" (!!) Let's add this to the list of "Reasons to go to Mars" ;-)
      $endgroup$
      – uhoh
      46 mins ago







    • 1




      $begingroup$
      Yes it was a surprising finding because everyone used nitrate selective electrodes without ever realizing that it also responds to perchlorate far more effectively.
      $endgroup$
      – M. Farooq
      43 mins ago
















    • $begingroup$
      "Nobody knew on Earth" (!!) Let's add this to the list of "Reasons to go to Mars" ;-)
      $endgroup$
      – uhoh
      46 mins ago







    • 1




      $begingroup$
      Yes it was a surprising finding because everyone used nitrate selective electrodes without ever realizing that it also responds to perchlorate far more effectively.
      $endgroup$
      – M. Farooq
      43 mins ago















    $begingroup$
    "Nobody knew on Earth" (!!) Let's add this to the list of "Reasons to go to Mars" ;-)
    $endgroup$
    – uhoh
    46 mins ago





    $begingroup$
    "Nobody knew on Earth" (!!) Let's add this to the list of "Reasons to go to Mars" ;-)
    $endgroup$
    – uhoh
    46 mins ago





    1




    1




    $begingroup$
    Yes it was a surprising finding because everyone used nitrate selective electrodes without ever realizing that it also responds to perchlorate far more effectively.
    $endgroup$
    – M. Farooq
    43 mins ago




    $begingroup$
    Yes it was a surprising finding because everyone used nitrate selective electrodes without ever realizing that it also responds to perchlorate far more effectively.
    $endgroup$
    – M. Farooq
    43 mins ago











    0












    $begingroup$


    Your Question: Which "exotic salt" can lower water's freezing point by $pu-70 ^circ C$?




    Here is your "exotic compound" although it is not a salt by definition. It is a base: Aqua ammonia, also called ammoniacal liquor, ammonia liquor, or ammonia water, is produced by dissolving ammonia gas ($ceNH3$) in water. The proper chemical name of aqua ammonia is ammonium hydroxide ($ceNH4OH$), which is in following equilibrium with water:
    $$ceNH3 + H2O <=> NH4+ + OH-$$



    Ammonia is very soluble in water: According to Wikipedia, its solubility in water is $47% (w/w)$ at $pu0 ^circ C$, $31% (w/w)$ at $pu25 ^circ C$, and $18% (w/w)$ at $pu50 ^circ C$. Therefore it is ideal to cause large freezing point depression since its solubility increases with decreasing temperature. Now, let's see how are the freezing points of aqua ammonia solutions behave with increasing concentrations. The large scale manufacturer of aqua ammonia, Tanner Industries, listed following values of boiling and freezing points of various solutions in its Customer Manual:



    $$
    beginarrayccc \hline
    % ceNH3 text (by weight) & textApprox. Boiling point & text Approx. Freezing point \hline
    23.52 & pu103 ^circ F: (pu39.4 ^circ C) & pu-56 ^circ F: ( pu-48.9 ^circ C)\
    25.48 & pu95 ^circ F: (pu35.0 ^circ C) & pu-69 ^circ F : ( pu-56.1 ^circ C)\
    27.44 & pu88 ^circ F : (pu31.1 ^circ C) & pu-89 ^circ F: ( pu-67.2 ^circ C)\
    29.40 & pu85 ^circ F: (pu29.4 ^circ C) & pu-110 ^circ F : ( pu-78.9 ^circ C)\
    31.36 & pu73 ^circ F: (pu22.8 ^circ C) & pu-123 ^circ F : ( pu-86.1 ^circ C)\
    33.32 & pu66 ^circ F : (pu18.9 ^circ C) & pu-148 ^circ F: ( pu-100 ^circ C)\hline
    endarray
    $$



    Accordingly, anything between $29-33%$ of aqua ammonia solution would do the job.





    share









    $endgroup$

















      0












      $begingroup$


      Your Question: Which "exotic salt" can lower water's freezing point by $pu-70 ^circ C$?




      Here is your "exotic compound" although it is not a salt by definition. It is a base: Aqua ammonia, also called ammoniacal liquor, ammonia liquor, or ammonia water, is produced by dissolving ammonia gas ($ceNH3$) in water. The proper chemical name of aqua ammonia is ammonium hydroxide ($ceNH4OH$), which is in following equilibrium with water:
      $$ceNH3 + H2O <=> NH4+ + OH-$$



      Ammonia is very soluble in water: According to Wikipedia, its solubility in water is $47% (w/w)$ at $pu0 ^circ C$, $31% (w/w)$ at $pu25 ^circ C$, and $18% (w/w)$ at $pu50 ^circ C$. Therefore it is ideal to cause large freezing point depression since its solubility increases with decreasing temperature. Now, let's see how are the freezing points of aqua ammonia solutions behave with increasing concentrations. The large scale manufacturer of aqua ammonia, Tanner Industries, listed following values of boiling and freezing points of various solutions in its Customer Manual:



      $$
      beginarrayccc \hline
      % ceNH3 text (by weight) & textApprox. Boiling point & text Approx. Freezing point \hline
      23.52 & pu103 ^circ F: (pu39.4 ^circ C) & pu-56 ^circ F: ( pu-48.9 ^circ C)\
      25.48 & pu95 ^circ F: (pu35.0 ^circ C) & pu-69 ^circ F : ( pu-56.1 ^circ C)\
      27.44 & pu88 ^circ F : (pu31.1 ^circ C) & pu-89 ^circ F: ( pu-67.2 ^circ C)\
      29.40 & pu85 ^circ F: (pu29.4 ^circ C) & pu-110 ^circ F : ( pu-78.9 ^circ C)\
      31.36 & pu73 ^circ F: (pu22.8 ^circ C) & pu-123 ^circ F : ( pu-86.1 ^circ C)\
      33.32 & pu66 ^circ F : (pu18.9 ^circ C) & pu-148 ^circ F: ( pu-100 ^circ C)\hline
      endarray
      $$



      Accordingly, anything between $29-33%$ of aqua ammonia solution would do the job.





      share









      $endgroup$















        0












        0








        0





        $begingroup$


        Your Question: Which "exotic salt" can lower water's freezing point by $pu-70 ^circ C$?




        Here is your "exotic compound" although it is not a salt by definition. It is a base: Aqua ammonia, also called ammoniacal liquor, ammonia liquor, or ammonia water, is produced by dissolving ammonia gas ($ceNH3$) in water. The proper chemical name of aqua ammonia is ammonium hydroxide ($ceNH4OH$), which is in following equilibrium with water:
        $$ceNH3 + H2O <=> NH4+ + OH-$$



        Ammonia is very soluble in water: According to Wikipedia, its solubility in water is $47% (w/w)$ at $pu0 ^circ C$, $31% (w/w)$ at $pu25 ^circ C$, and $18% (w/w)$ at $pu50 ^circ C$. Therefore it is ideal to cause large freezing point depression since its solubility increases with decreasing temperature. Now, let's see how are the freezing points of aqua ammonia solutions behave with increasing concentrations. The large scale manufacturer of aqua ammonia, Tanner Industries, listed following values of boiling and freezing points of various solutions in its Customer Manual:



        $$
        beginarrayccc \hline
        % ceNH3 text (by weight) & textApprox. Boiling point & text Approx. Freezing point \hline
        23.52 & pu103 ^circ F: (pu39.4 ^circ C) & pu-56 ^circ F: ( pu-48.9 ^circ C)\
        25.48 & pu95 ^circ F: (pu35.0 ^circ C) & pu-69 ^circ F : ( pu-56.1 ^circ C)\
        27.44 & pu88 ^circ F : (pu31.1 ^circ C) & pu-89 ^circ F: ( pu-67.2 ^circ C)\
        29.40 & pu85 ^circ F: (pu29.4 ^circ C) & pu-110 ^circ F : ( pu-78.9 ^circ C)\
        31.36 & pu73 ^circ F: (pu22.8 ^circ C) & pu-123 ^circ F : ( pu-86.1 ^circ C)\
        33.32 & pu66 ^circ F : (pu18.9 ^circ C) & pu-148 ^circ F: ( pu-100 ^circ C)\hline
        endarray
        $$



        Accordingly, anything between $29-33%$ of aqua ammonia solution would do the job.





        share









        $endgroup$




        Your Question: Which "exotic salt" can lower water's freezing point by $pu-70 ^circ C$?




        Here is your "exotic compound" although it is not a salt by definition. It is a base: Aqua ammonia, also called ammoniacal liquor, ammonia liquor, or ammonia water, is produced by dissolving ammonia gas ($ceNH3$) in water. The proper chemical name of aqua ammonia is ammonium hydroxide ($ceNH4OH$), which is in following equilibrium with water:
        $$ceNH3 + H2O <=> NH4+ + OH-$$



        Ammonia is very soluble in water: According to Wikipedia, its solubility in water is $47% (w/w)$ at $pu0 ^circ C$, $31% (w/w)$ at $pu25 ^circ C$, and $18% (w/w)$ at $pu50 ^circ C$. Therefore it is ideal to cause large freezing point depression since its solubility increases with decreasing temperature. Now, let's see how are the freezing points of aqua ammonia solutions behave with increasing concentrations. The large scale manufacturer of aqua ammonia, Tanner Industries, listed following values of boiling and freezing points of various solutions in its Customer Manual:



        $$
        beginarrayccc \hline
        % ceNH3 text (by weight) & textApprox. Boiling point & text Approx. Freezing point \hline
        23.52 & pu103 ^circ F: (pu39.4 ^circ C) & pu-56 ^circ F: ( pu-48.9 ^circ C)\
        25.48 & pu95 ^circ F: (pu35.0 ^circ C) & pu-69 ^circ F : ( pu-56.1 ^circ C)\
        27.44 & pu88 ^circ F : (pu31.1 ^circ C) & pu-89 ^circ F: ( pu-67.2 ^circ C)\
        29.40 & pu85 ^circ F: (pu29.4 ^circ C) & pu-110 ^circ F : ( pu-78.9 ^circ C)\
        31.36 & pu73 ^circ F: (pu22.8 ^circ C) & pu-123 ^circ F : ( pu-86.1 ^circ C)\
        33.32 & pu66 ^circ F : (pu18.9 ^circ C) & pu-148 ^circ F: ( pu-100 ^circ C)\hline
        endarray
        $$



        Accordingly, anything between $29-33%$ of aqua ammonia solution would do the job.






        share











        share


        share










        answered 17 secs ago









        Mathew MahindaratneMathew Mahindaratne

        6,813927




        6,813927



























            draft saved

            draft discarded
















































            Thanks for contributing an answer to Chemistry Stack Exchange!


            • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

            But avoid


            • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

            • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.

            Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.


            To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




            draft saved


            draft discarded














            StackExchange.ready(
            function ()
            StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fchemistry.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f114837%2fwhich-exotic-salt-can-lower-waters-freezing-point-by-70-c%23new-answer', 'question_page');

            );

            Post as a guest















            Required, but never shown





















































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown

































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown







            Popular posts from this blog

            19. јануар Садржај Догађаји Рођења Смрти Празници и дани сећања Види још Референце Мени за навигацијуу

            Israel Cuprins Etimologie | Istorie | Geografie | Politică | Demografie | Educație | Economie | Cultură | Note explicative | Note bibliografice | Bibliografie | Legături externe | Meniu de navigaresite web oficialfacebooktweeterGoogle+Instagramcanal YouTubeInstagramtextmodificaremodificarewww.technion.ac.ilnew.huji.ac.ilwww.weizmann.ac.ilwww1.biu.ac.ilenglish.tau.ac.ilwww.haifa.ac.ilin.bgu.ac.ilwww.openu.ac.ilwww.ariel.ac.ilCIA FactbookHarta Israelului"Negotiating Jerusalem," Palestine–Israel JournalThe Schizoid Nature of Modern Hebrew: A Slavic Language in Search of a Semitic Past„Arabic in Israel: an official language and a cultural bridge”„Latest Population Statistics for Israel”„Israel Population”„Tables”„Report for Selected Countries and Subjects”Human Development Report 2016: Human Development for Everyone„Distribution of family income - Gini index”The World FactbookJerusalem Law„Israel”„Israel”„Zionist Leaders: David Ben-Gurion 1886–1973”„The status of Jerusalem”„Analysis: Kadima's big plans”„Israel's Hard-Learned Lessons”„The Legacy of Undefined Borders, Tel Aviv Notes No. 40, 5 iunie 2002”„Israel Journal: A Land Without Borders”„Population”„Israel closes decade with population of 7.5 million”Time Series-DataBank„Selected Statistics on Jerusalem Day 2007 (Hebrew)”Golan belongs to Syria, Druze protestGlobal Survey 2006: Middle East Progress Amid Global Gains in FreedomWHO: Life expectancy in Israel among highest in the worldInternational Monetary Fund, World Economic Outlook Database, April 2011: Nominal GDP list of countries. Data for the year 2010.„Israel's accession to the OECD”Popular Opinion„On the Move”Hosea 12:5„Walking the Bible Timeline”„Palestine: History”„Return to Zion”An invention called 'the Jewish people' – Haaretz – Israel NewsoriginalJewish and Non-Jewish Population of Palestine-Israel (1517–2004)ImmigrationJewishvirtuallibrary.orgChapter One: The Heralders of Zionism„The birth of modern Israel: A scrap of paper that changed history”„League of Nations: The Mandate for Palestine, 24 iulie 1922”The Population of Palestine Prior to 1948originalBackground Paper No. 47 (ST/DPI/SER.A/47)History: Foreign DominationTwo Hundred and Seventh Plenary Meeting„Israel (Labor Zionism)”Population, by Religion and Population GroupThe Suez CrisisAdolf EichmannJustice Ministry Reply to Amnesty International Report„The Interregnum”Israel Ministry of Foreign Affairs – The Palestinian National Covenant- July 1968Research on terrorism: trends, achievements & failuresThe Routledge Atlas of the Arab–Israeli conflict: The Complete History of the Struggle and the Efforts to Resolve It"George Habash, Palestinian Terrorism Tactician, Dies at 82."„1973: Arab states attack Israeli forces”Agranat Commission„Has Israel Annexed East Jerusalem?”original„After 4 Years, Intifada Still Smolders”From the End of the Cold War to 2001originalThe Oslo Accords, 1993Israel-PLO Recognition – Exchange of Letters between PM Rabin and Chairman Arafat – Sept 9- 1993Foundation for Middle East PeaceSources of Population Growth: Total Israeli Population and Settler Population, 1991–2003original„Israel marks Rabin assassination”The Wye River Memorandumoriginal„West Bank barrier route disputed, Israeli missile kills 2”"Permanent Ceasefire to Be Based on Creation Of Buffer Zone Free of Armed Personnel Other than UN, Lebanese Forces"„Hezbollah kills 8 soldiers, kidnaps two in offensive on northern border”„Olmert confirms peace talks with Syria”„Battleground Gaza: Israeli ground forces invade the strip”„IDF begins Gaza troop withdrawal, hours after ending 3-week offensive”„THE LAND: Geography and Climate”„Area of districts, sub-districts, natural regions and lakes”„Israel - Geography”„Makhteshim Country”Israel and the Palestinian Territories„Makhtesh Ramon”„The Living Dead Sea”„Temperatures reach record high in Pakistan”„Climate Extremes In Israel”Israel in figures„Deuteronom”„JNF: 240 million trees planted since 1901”„Vegetation of Israel and Neighboring Countries”Environmental Law in Israel„Executive branch”„Israel's election process explained”„The Electoral System in Israel”„Constitution for Israel”„All 120 incoming Knesset members”„Statul ISRAEL”„The Judiciary: The Court System”„Israel's high court unique in region”„Israel and the International Criminal Court: A Legal Battlefield”„Localities and population, by population group, district, sub-district and natural region”„Israel: Districts, Major Cities, Urban Localities & Metropolitan Areas”„Israel-Egypt Relations: Background & Overview of Peace Treaty”„Solana to Haaretz: New Rules of War Needed for Age of Terror”„Israel's Announcement Regarding Settlements”„United Nations Security Council Resolution 497”„Security Council resolution 478 (1980) on the status of Jerusalem”„Arabs will ask U.N. to seek razing of Israeli wall”„Olmert: Willing to trade land for peace”„Mapping Peace between Syria and Israel”„Egypt: Israel must accept the land-for-peace formula”„Israel: Age structure from 2005 to 2015”„Global, regional, and national disability-adjusted life years (DALYs) for 306 diseases and injuries and healthy life expectancy (HALE) for 188 countries, 1990–2013: quantifying the epidemiological transition”10.1016/S0140-6736(15)61340-X„World Health Statistics 2014”„Life expectancy for Israeli men world's 4th highest”„Family Structure and Well-Being Across Israel's Diverse Population”„Fertility among Jewish and Muslim Women in Israel, by Level of Religiosity, 1979-2009”„Israel leaders in birth rate, but poverty major challenge”„Ethnic Groups”„Israel's population: Over 8.5 million”„Israel - Ethnic groups”„Jews, by country of origin and age”„Minority Communities in Israel: Background & Overview”„Israel”„Language in Israel”„Selected Data from the 2011 Social Survey on Mastery of the Hebrew Language and Usage of Languages”„Religions”„5 facts about Israeli Druze, a unique religious and ethnic group”„Israël”Israel Country Study Guide„Haredi city in Negev – blessing or curse?”„New town Harish harbors hopes of being more than another Pleasantville”„List of localities, in alphabetical order”„Muncitorii români, doriți în Israel”„Prietenia româno-israeliană la nevoie se cunoaște”„The Higher Education System in Israel”„Middle East”„Academic Ranking of World Universities 2016”„Israel”„Israel”„Jewish Nobel Prize Winners”„All Nobel Prizes in Literature”„All Nobel Peace Prizes”„All Prizes in Economic Sciences”„All Nobel Prizes in Chemistry”„List of Fields Medallists”„Sakharov Prize”„Țara care și-a sfidat "destinul" și se bate umăr la umăr cu Silicon Valley”„Apple's R&D center in Israel grew to about 800 employees”„Tim Cook: Apple's Herzliya R&D center second-largest in world”„Lecții de economie de la Israel”„Land use”Israel Investment and Business GuideA Country Study: IsraelCentral Bureau of StatisticsFlorin Diaconu, „Kadima: Flexibilitate și pragmatism, dar nici un compromis în chestiuni vitale", în Revista Institutului Diplomatic Român, anul I, numărul I, semestrul I, 2006, pp. 71-72Florin Diaconu, „Likud: Dreapta israeliană constant opusă retrocedării teritoriilor cureite prin luptă în 1967", în Revista Institutului Diplomatic Român, anul I, numărul I, semestrul I, 2006, pp. 73-74MassadaIsraelul a crescut in 50 de ani cât alte state intr-un mileniuIsrael Government PortalIsraelIsraelIsraelmmmmmXX451232cb118646298(data)4027808-634110000 0004 0372 0767n7900328503691455-bb46-37e3-91d2-cb064a35ffcc1003570400564274ge1294033523775214929302638955X146498911146498911

            Кастелфранко ди Сопра Становништво Референце Спољашње везе Мени за навигацију43°37′18″ СГШ; 11°33′32″ ИГД / 43.62156° СГШ; 11.55885° ИГД / 43.62156; 11.5588543°37′18″ СГШ; 11°33′32″ ИГД / 43.62156° СГШ; 11.55885° ИГД / 43.62156; 11.558853179688„The GeoNames geographical database”„Istituto Nazionale di Statistica”проширитиууWorldCat156923403n850174324558639-1cb14643287r(подаци)