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Is all-caps blackletter no longer taboo?


Blackletter fonts supporting long s and r rotunda?Is there anyway to convert all texts to outlines in Sketch App?How do typefaces become taboo?What is it called when all the characters are typed out for typeface examination?How to see all chars in a font from FontForge













1















Received typographic wisdom holds that blackletter (“Old English”, “Gothic”) text only looks good in lower case or with initial capitalization — never with capital letters in series. However, in the last couple of decades, all-caps blackletter type and calligraphy have become normalized in a few cases where reading speed is unimportant. Specifically, decoration in "cholo" gangster culture and album cover artwork have adopted it, often in laid out in the shape of an arch; examples follow.



Apparently, some designers are doing what was previously forbidden. In light of the cover of the record by No Doubt (a major-label band), has all-caps blackletter gone mainstream? Did breaking the old rule lead to a new understanding?



Teen Angels magazine coverDark Funeral band logo"Barragán" tattooNo Doubt album cover










share|improve this question
























  • It's a counter-culture, rebellious "look." Some like it, some don't. It's a personal choice. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.

    – Stan
    8 hours ago






  • 1





    The only taboo in design is bad taste

    – Danielillo
    8 hours ago















1















Received typographic wisdom holds that blackletter (“Old English”, “Gothic”) text only looks good in lower case or with initial capitalization — never with capital letters in series. However, in the last couple of decades, all-caps blackletter type and calligraphy have become normalized in a few cases where reading speed is unimportant. Specifically, decoration in "cholo" gangster culture and album cover artwork have adopted it, often in laid out in the shape of an arch; examples follow.



Apparently, some designers are doing what was previously forbidden. In light of the cover of the record by No Doubt (a major-label band), has all-caps blackletter gone mainstream? Did breaking the old rule lead to a new understanding?



Teen Angels magazine coverDark Funeral band logo"Barragán" tattooNo Doubt album cover










share|improve this question
























  • It's a counter-culture, rebellious "look." Some like it, some don't. It's a personal choice. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.

    – Stan
    8 hours ago






  • 1





    The only taboo in design is bad taste

    – Danielillo
    8 hours ago













1












1








1








Received typographic wisdom holds that blackletter (“Old English”, “Gothic”) text only looks good in lower case or with initial capitalization — never with capital letters in series. However, in the last couple of decades, all-caps blackletter type and calligraphy have become normalized in a few cases where reading speed is unimportant. Specifically, decoration in "cholo" gangster culture and album cover artwork have adopted it, often in laid out in the shape of an arch; examples follow.



Apparently, some designers are doing what was previously forbidden. In light of the cover of the record by No Doubt (a major-label band), has all-caps blackletter gone mainstream? Did breaking the old rule lead to a new understanding?



Teen Angels magazine coverDark Funeral band logo"Barragán" tattooNo Doubt album cover










share|improve this question
















Received typographic wisdom holds that blackletter (“Old English”, “Gothic”) text only looks good in lower case or with initial capitalization — never with capital letters in series. However, in the last couple of decades, all-caps blackletter type and calligraphy have become normalized in a few cases where reading speed is unimportant. Specifically, decoration in "cholo" gangster culture and album cover artwork have adopted it, often in laid out in the shape of an arch; examples follow.



Apparently, some designers are doing what was previously forbidden. In light of the cover of the record by No Doubt (a major-label band), has all-caps blackletter gone mainstream? Did breaking the old rule lead to a new understanding?



Teen Angels magazine coverDark Funeral band logo"Barragán" tattooNo Doubt album cover







typefaces trends calligraphy type-theory blackletter






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited 8 hours ago









Wrzlprmft

11.2k44576




11.2k44576










asked 9 hours ago









Aaron BrickAaron Brick

1165




1165












  • It's a counter-culture, rebellious "look." Some like it, some don't. It's a personal choice. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.

    – Stan
    8 hours ago






  • 1





    The only taboo in design is bad taste

    – Danielillo
    8 hours ago

















  • It's a counter-culture, rebellious "look." Some like it, some don't. It's a personal choice. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.

    – Stan
    8 hours ago






  • 1





    The only taboo in design is bad taste

    – Danielillo
    8 hours ago
















It's a counter-culture, rebellious "look." Some like it, some don't. It's a personal choice. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.

– Stan
8 hours ago





It's a counter-culture, rebellious "look." Some like it, some don't. It's a personal choice. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.

– Stan
8 hours ago




1




1





The only taboo in design is bad taste

– Danielillo
8 hours ago





The only taboo in design is bad taste

– Danielillo
8 hours ago










2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















4














  1. You can't use tattoo art as a reference. Tattoo art often fails to follow any rhyme or reasoning. It's always a one-off and created with the intention of a very narrow audience, not broader viewing. (And there's always someone at hand to immediately say: "No, it says xxxx.")


  2. Bad design happens. There's no "Global Design Tribunal" which determines what one must or must not do with respect to design and will punish offenders. – The "Dark Funeral" logo/symbol falls into this to me. It was probably created by one of the band members or their friend who has no formal training and just wanted something which "looks evil". So, they thought that "looked evil". Black metal bands are notorious for horrid type design. I think it is unwise to prescribe traditional training thoughts or guidelines to anything related to music industry or band "logos". They are rarely created by trained designers.


  3. Sometimes it may be intentional. The No Doubt album, with it's poor blown-out photo, and bad typography all seem very intentional to me to avoid a "slick" record industry look. Sometimes when bands which are seen as more alternative start bordering upon being seen as "selling out" they go specifically the other direction with design and stage productions to try and curb those comments.


None of this means all cap blackletter is a good choice in general – or a common choice. It's merely a choice they made in your samples.






share|improve this answer

























  • For there to be good design there has to be bad design ;)

    – joojaa
    8 hours ago


















1















Received typographic wisdom holds that Blackletter ("Old English", "Gothic") text only looks good in lower case or with initial capitalization — never with capital letters in series




If you ask me (and all sources I have ever read about the matter), the problem is not that all-caps blackletter does not look good. It just is very difficult to read due to the various decorative elements.



Therefore if you do not care about readability that for whatever reason, using all-caps blackletter is at least not completely insane:



  • All your examples feature titles, logos, or similar. Not only is only one or two words that are difficult to read, they are usually not meant to be read at all. In particular consider the tattoo: It’s mostly exists to please the wearer (and he has to use two mirrors to see it). Everybody else who gets to see it, probably has enough time to decipher it.



  • One historic use of all-caps blackletter was for printer’s locations on titles, such as here:



    all-caps blackletter used for location on a title(Source)



    all-caps blackletter used for location on a title



    Again, this is not a case where readability is very important.




  • Another historic use of all-caps blackletter was for God, Jesus, etc. in religious texts:



    Example of “GOTT” (God) and “JESU” in all-caps in a German text



    Example of “JESOM” (God) in all-caps in a Sorbian text



    I think we can safely assume that the authors/typesetters of these texts would not have chosen all-caps here if they considered it ugly. Also, given that this is limited to a very few, usually isolated words, the impact of readability is not big.







share|improve this answer























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    2 Answers
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    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

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    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes









    4














    1. You can't use tattoo art as a reference. Tattoo art often fails to follow any rhyme or reasoning. It's always a one-off and created with the intention of a very narrow audience, not broader viewing. (And there's always someone at hand to immediately say: "No, it says xxxx.")


    2. Bad design happens. There's no "Global Design Tribunal" which determines what one must or must not do with respect to design and will punish offenders. – The "Dark Funeral" logo/symbol falls into this to me. It was probably created by one of the band members or their friend who has no formal training and just wanted something which "looks evil". So, they thought that "looked evil". Black metal bands are notorious for horrid type design. I think it is unwise to prescribe traditional training thoughts or guidelines to anything related to music industry or band "logos". They are rarely created by trained designers.


    3. Sometimes it may be intentional. The No Doubt album, with it's poor blown-out photo, and bad typography all seem very intentional to me to avoid a "slick" record industry look. Sometimes when bands which are seen as more alternative start bordering upon being seen as "selling out" they go specifically the other direction with design and stage productions to try and curb those comments.


    None of this means all cap blackletter is a good choice in general – or a common choice. It's merely a choice they made in your samples.






    share|improve this answer

























    • For there to be good design there has to be bad design ;)

      – joojaa
      8 hours ago















    4














    1. You can't use tattoo art as a reference. Tattoo art often fails to follow any rhyme or reasoning. It's always a one-off and created with the intention of a very narrow audience, not broader viewing. (And there's always someone at hand to immediately say: "No, it says xxxx.")


    2. Bad design happens. There's no "Global Design Tribunal" which determines what one must or must not do with respect to design and will punish offenders. – The "Dark Funeral" logo/symbol falls into this to me. It was probably created by one of the band members or their friend who has no formal training and just wanted something which "looks evil". So, they thought that "looked evil". Black metal bands are notorious for horrid type design. I think it is unwise to prescribe traditional training thoughts or guidelines to anything related to music industry or band "logos". They are rarely created by trained designers.


    3. Sometimes it may be intentional. The No Doubt album, with it's poor blown-out photo, and bad typography all seem very intentional to me to avoid a "slick" record industry look. Sometimes when bands which are seen as more alternative start bordering upon being seen as "selling out" they go specifically the other direction with design and stage productions to try and curb those comments.


    None of this means all cap blackletter is a good choice in general – or a common choice. It's merely a choice they made in your samples.






    share|improve this answer

























    • For there to be good design there has to be bad design ;)

      – joojaa
      8 hours ago













    4












    4








    4







    1. You can't use tattoo art as a reference. Tattoo art often fails to follow any rhyme or reasoning. It's always a one-off and created with the intention of a very narrow audience, not broader viewing. (And there's always someone at hand to immediately say: "No, it says xxxx.")


    2. Bad design happens. There's no "Global Design Tribunal" which determines what one must or must not do with respect to design and will punish offenders. – The "Dark Funeral" logo/symbol falls into this to me. It was probably created by one of the band members or their friend who has no formal training and just wanted something which "looks evil". So, they thought that "looked evil". Black metal bands are notorious for horrid type design. I think it is unwise to prescribe traditional training thoughts or guidelines to anything related to music industry or band "logos". They are rarely created by trained designers.


    3. Sometimes it may be intentional. The No Doubt album, with it's poor blown-out photo, and bad typography all seem very intentional to me to avoid a "slick" record industry look. Sometimes when bands which are seen as more alternative start bordering upon being seen as "selling out" they go specifically the other direction with design and stage productions to try and curb those comments.


    None of this means all cap blackletter is a good choice in general – or a common choice. It's merely a choice they made in your samples.






    share|improve this answer















    1. You can't use tattoo art as a reference. Tattoo art often fails to follow any rhyme or reasoning. It's always a one-off and created with the intention of a very narrow audience, not broader viewing. (And there's always someone at hand to immediately say: "No, it says xxxx.")


    2. Bad design happens. There's no "Global Design Tribunal" which determines what one must or must not do with respect to design and will punish offenders. – The "Dark Funeral" logo/symbol falls into this to me. It was probably created by one of the band members or their friend who has no formal training and just wanted something which "looks evil". So, they thought that "looked evil". Black metal bands are notorious for horrid type design. I think it is unwise to prescribe traditional training thoughts or guidelines to anything related to music industry or band "logos". They are rarely created by trained designers.


    3. Sometimes it may be intentional. The No Doubt album, with it's poor blown-out photo, and bad typography all seem very intentional to me to avoid a "slick" record industry look. Sometimes when bands which are seen as more alternative start bordering upon being seen as "selling out" they go specifically the other direction with design and stage productions to try and curb those comments.


    None of this means all cap blackletter is a good choice in general – or a common choice. It's merely a choice they made in your samples.







    share|improve this answer














    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer








    edited 8 hours ago









    Wrzlprmft

    11.2k44576




    11.2k44576










    answered 9 hours ago









    ScottScott

    152k14210428




    152k14210428












    • For there to be good design there has to be bad design ;)

      – joojaa
      8 hours ago

















    • For there to be good design there has to be bad design ;)

      – joojaa
      8 hours ago
















    For there to be good design there has to be bad design ;)

    – joojaa
    8 hours ago





    For there to be good design there has to be bad design ;)

    – joojaa
    8 hours ago











    1















    Received typographic wisdom holds that Blackletter ("Old English", "Gothic") text only looks good in lower case or with initial capitalization — never with capital letters in series




    If you ask me (and all sources I have ever read about the matter), the problem is not that all-caps blackletter does not look good. It just is very difficult to read due to the various decorative elements.



    Therefore if you do not care about readability that for whatever reason, using all-caps blackletter is at least not completely insane:



    • All your examples feature titles, logos, or similar. Not only is only one or two words that are difficult to read, they are usually not meant to be read at all. In particular consider the tattoo: It’s mostly exists to please the wearer (and he has to use two mirrors to see it). Everybody else who gets to see it, probably has enough time to decipher it.



    • One historic use of all-caps blackletter was for printer’s locations on titles, such as here:



      all-caps blackletter used for location on a title(Source)



      all-caps blackletter used for location on a title



      Again, this is not a case where readability is very important.




    • Another historic use of all-caps blackletter was for God, Jesus, etc. in religious texts:



      Example of “GOTT” (God) and “JESU” in all-caps in a German text



      Example of “JESOM” (God) in all-caps in a Sorbian text



      I think we can safely assume that the authors/typesetters of these texts would not have chosen all-caps here if they considered it ugly. Also, given that this is limited to a very few, usually isolated words, the impact of readability is not big.







    share|improve this answer



























      1















      Received typographic wisdom holds that Blackletter ("Old English", "Gothic") text only looks good in lower case or with initial capitalization — never with capital letters in series




      If you ask me (and all sources I have ever read about the matter), the problem is not that all-caps blackletter does not look good. It just is very difficult to read due to the various decorative elements.



      Therefore if you do not care about readability that for whatever reason, using all-caps blackletter is at least not completely insane:



      • All your examples feature titles, logos, or similar. Not only is only one or two words that are difficult to read, they are usually not meant to be read at all. In particular consider the tattoo: It’s mostly exists to please the wearer (and he has to use two mirrors to see it). Everybody else who gets to see it, probably has enough time to decipher it.



      • One historic use of all-caps blackletter was for printer’s locations on titles, such as here:



        all-caps blackletter used for location on a title(Source)



        all-caps blackletter used for location on a title



        Again, this is not a case where readability is very important.




      • Another historic use of all-caps blackletter was for God, Jesus, etc. in religious texts:



        Example of “GOTT” (God) and “JESU” in all-caps in a German text



        Example of “JESOM” (God) in all-caps in a Sorbian text



        I think we can safely assume that the authors/typesetters of these texts would not have chosen all-caps here if they considered it ugly. Also, given that this is limited to a very few, usually isolated words, the impact of readability is not big.







      share|improve this answer

























        1












        1








        1








        Received typographic wisdom holds that Blackletter ("Old English", "Gothic") text only looks good in lower case or with initial capitalization — never with capital letters in series




        If you ask me (and all sources I have ever read about the matter), the problem is not that all-caps blackletter does not look good. It just is very difficult to read due to the various decorative elements.



        Therefore if you do not care about readability that for whatever reason, using all-caps blackletter is at least not completely insane:



        • All your examples feature titles, logos, or similar. Not only is only one or two words that are difficult to read, they are usually not meant to be read at all. In particular consider the tattoo: It’s mostly exists to please the wearer (and he has to use two mirrors to see it). Everybody else who gets to see it, probably has enough time to decipher it.



        • One historic use of all-caps blackletter was for printer’s locations on titles, such as here:



          all-caps blackletter used for location on a title(Source)



          all-caps blackletter used for location on a title



          Again, this is not a case where readability is very important.




        • Another historic use of all-caps blackletter was for God, Jesus, etc. in religious texts:



          Example of “GOTT” (God) and “JESU” in all-caps in a German text



          Example of “JESOM” (God) in all-caps in a Sorbian text



          I think we can safely assume that the authors/typesetters of these texts would not have chosen all-caps here if they considered it ugly. Also, given that this is limited to a very few, usually isolated words, the impact of readability is not big.







        share|improve this answer














        Received typographic wisdom holds that Blackletter ("Old English", "Gothic") text only looks good in lower case or with initial capitalization — never with capital letters in series




        If you ask me (and all sources I have ever read about the matter), the problem is not that all-caps blackletter does not look good. It just is very difficult to read due to the various decorative elements.



        Therefore if you do not care about readability that for whatever reason, using all-caps blackletter is at least not completely insane:



        • All your examples feature titles, logos, or similar. Not only is only one or two words that are difficult to read, they are usually not meant to be read at all. In particular consider the tattoo: It’s mostly exists to please the wearer (and he has to use two mirrors to see it). Everybody else who gets to see it, probably has enough time to decipher it.



        • One historic use of all-caps blackletter was for printer’s locations on titles, such as here:



          all-caps blackletter used for location on a title(Source)



          all-caps blackletter used for location on a title



          Again, this is not a case where readability is very important.




        • Another historic use of all-caps blackletter was for God, Jesus, etc. in religious texts:



          Example of “GOTT” (God) and “JESU” in all-caps in a German text



          Example of “JESOM” (God) in all-caps in a Sorbian text



          I think we can safely assume that the authors/typesetters of these texts would not have chosen all-caps here if they considered it ugly. Also, given that this is limited to a very few, usually isolated words, the impact of readability is not big.








        share|improve this answer












        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer










        answered 8 hours ago









        WrzlprmftWrzlprmft

        11.2k44576




        11.2k44576



























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