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Do dragons smell of lilacs?


How can characters/players identify that a polymorphed dragon is a dragon?Mating behaviours of dragonsAre dragons able to recognize other dragons in humanoid form?Is Dungeons & Dragons the origin of “Bahamut” as a dragon?What does a doppelganger smell like?Why did the designers make it so chromatic dragons can't shapechange?Can Greyhawk's dragons seriously not write?Dealing with dragonsIs there a dragon-level threat to the dragons in the Forgotten Realms?What spell list must dragons use, if any?How can characters/players identify that a polymorphed dragon is a dragon?






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6












$begingroup$


I had an interesting thing happen in my last session of Dungeons and Dragons 5th edition.
My players are in a dragon heavy adventure.
A player tried to do a perception check to detect the scent of lilacs. Normally whenever a character wants to do a perception check I just tell them to go for it, though this time I asked them why.
It seems that he heard somewhere that a dragon in human form smells of lilacs.



I had never heard of this before. Clearly there are at least 3 relevant questions:



  1. Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?

  2. Are there actually any dragons in human form in the room? (This one I know the answer to)

  3. Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this? You would think that dragons would want to keep this a secret.

Have any of you heard of anything like this before?



I did not allow the check because he couldn't show how his character would have come across this knowledge. Though I was tempted to have him preform the check only to notice that the room was lined with lilacs.



Their are a few ways this can play out,



  1. If there are no dragons, then they can't find one no matter how hard they look.

  2. There is someone who smells of lilacs, though if they are or are not a dragon is another matter entirely.

  3. There is no way that they should have heard this, so I don't allow the check.









share|improve this question









New contributor



Tobias_Marco is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    Which edition is this about?
    $endgroup$
    – J. A. Streich
    8 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @J.A.Streich It looks like they're just asking about general lore, but still a good idea to focus on a specific addition for at least part of the answer.
    $endgroup$
    – NautArch
    8 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    Welcome! You tagged this question with [dungeons-and-dragons] which is used to indicate D&D across all editions. You state you are playing 5e. Does this mean that you are interested in lore from any edition or would you prefer just from 5e?
    $endgroup$
    – Sdjz
    8 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Is a player asking to roll a perception check normal procedure at your table?
    $endgroup$
    – Mark Wells
    8 hours ago







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    So is this the player saying at the table that he heard that dragons smell like lilac, or is this an in-character claim that the character says he heard that?
    $endgroup$
    – mxyzplk
    7 hours ago

















6












$begingroup$


I had an interesting thing happen in my last session of Dungeons and Dragons 5th edition.
My players are in a dragon heavy adventure.
A player tried to do a perception check to detect the scent of lilacs. Normally whenever a character wants to do a perception check I just tell them to go for it, though this time I asked them why.
It seems that he heard somewhere that a dragon in human form smells of lilacs.



I had never heard of this before. Clearly there are at least 3 relevant questions:



  1. Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?

  2. Are there actually any dragons in human form in the room? (This one I know the answer to)

  3. Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this? You would think that dragons would want to keep this a secret.

Have any of you heard of anything like this before?



I did not allow the check because he couldn't show how his character would have come across this knowledge. Though I was tempted to have him preform the check only to notice that the room was lined with lilacs.



Their are a few ways this can play out,



  1. If there are no dragons, then they can't find one no matter how hard they look.

  2. There is someone who smells of lilacs, though if they are or are not a dragon is another matter entirely.

  3. There is no way that they should have heard this, so I don't allow the check.









share|improve this question









New contributor



Tobias_Marco is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    Which edition is this about?
    $endgroup$
    – J. A. Streich
    8 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @J.A.Streich It looks like they're just asking about general lore, but still a good idea to focus on a specific addition for at least part of the answer.
    $endgroup$
    – NautArch
    8 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    Welcome! You tagged this question with [dungeons-and-dragons] which is used to indicate D&D across all editions. You state you are playing 5e. Does this mean that you are interested in lore from any edition or would you prefer just from 5e?
    $endgroup$
    – Sdjz
    8 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Is a player asking to roll a perception check normal procedure at your table?
    $endgroup$
    – Mark Wells
    8 hours ago







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    So is this the player saying at the table that he heard that dragons smell like lilac, or is this an in-character claim that the character says he heard that?
    $endgroup$
    – mxyzplk
    7 hours ago













6












6








6





$begingroup$


I had an interesting thing happen in my last session of Dungeons and Dragons 5th edition.
My players are in a dragon heavy adventure.
A player tried to do a perception check to detect the scent of lilacs. Normally whenever a character wants to do a perception check I just tell them to go for it, though this time I asked them why.
It seems that he heard somewhere that a dragon in human form smells of lilacs.



I had never heard of this before. Clearly there are at least 3 relevant questions:



  1. Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?

  2. Are there actually any dragons in human form in the room? (This one I know the answer to)

  3. Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this? You would think that dragons would want to keep this a secret.

Have any of you heard of anything like this before?



I did not allow the check because he couldn't show how his character would have come across this knowledge. Though I was tempted to have him preform the check only to notice that the room was lined with lilacs.



Their are a few ways this can play out,



  1. If there are no dragons, then they can't find one no matter how hard they look.

  2. There is someone who smells of lilacs, though if they are or are not a dragon is another matter entirely.

  3. There is no way that they should have heard this, so I don't allow the check.









share|improve this question









New contributor



Tobias_Marco is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






$endgroup$




I had an interesting thing happen in my last session of Dungeons and Dragons 5th edition.
My players are in a dragon heavy adventure.
A player tried to do a perception check to detect the scent of lilacs. Normally whenever a character wants to do a perception check I just tell them to go for it, though this time I asked them why.
It seems that he heard somewhere that a dragon in human form smells of lilacs.



I had never heard of this before. Clearly there are at least 3 relevant questions:



  1. Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?

  2. Are there actually any dragons in human form in the room? (This one I know the answer to)

  3. Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this? You would think that dragons would want to keep this a secret.

Have any of you heard of anything like this before?



I did not allow the check because he couldn't show how his character would have come across this knowledge. Though I was tempted to have him preform the check only to notice that the room was lined with lilacs.



Their are a few ways this can play out,



  1. If there are no dragons, then they can't find one no matter how hard they look.

  2. There is someone who smells of lilacs, though if they are or are not a dragon is another matter entirely.

  3. There is no way that they should have heard this, so I don't allow the check.






dnd-5e dungeons-and-dragons lore polymorph dragons






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edited 8 hours ago









NautArch

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asked 8 hours ago









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  • $begingroup$
    Which edition is this about?
    $endgroup$
    – J. A. Streich
    8 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @J.A.Streich It looks like they're just asking about general lore, but still a good idea to focus on a specific addition for at least part of the answer.
    $endgroup$
    – NautArch
    8 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    Welcome! You tagged this question with [dungeons-and-dragons] which is used to indicate D&D across all editions. You state you are playing 5e. Does this mean that you are interested in lore from any edition or would you prefer just from 5e?
    $endgroup$
    – Sdjz
    8 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Is a player asking to roll a perception check normal procedure at your table?
    $endgroup$
    – Mark Wells
    8 hours ago







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    So is this the player saying at the table that he heard that dragons smell like lilac, or is this an in-character claim that the character says he heard that?
    $endgroup$
    – mxyzplk
    7 hours ago
















  • $begingroup$
    Which edition is this about?
    $endgroup$
    – J. A. Streich
    8 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @J.A.Streich It looks like they're just asking about general lore, but still a good idea to focus on a specific addition for at least part of the answer.
    $endgroup$
    – NautArch
    8 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    Welcome! You tagged this question with [dungeons-and-dragons] which is used to indicate D&D across all editions. You state you are playing 5e. Does this mean that you are interested in lore from any edition or would you prefer just from 5e?
    $endgroup$
    – Sdjz
    8 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Is a player asking to roll a perception check normal procedure at your table?
    $endgroup$
    – Mark Wells
    8 hours ago







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    So is this the player saying at the table that he heard that dragons smell like lilac, or is this an in-character claim that the character says he heard that?
    $endgroup$
    – mxyzplk
    7 hours ago















$begingroup$
Which edition is this about?
$endgroup$
– J. A. Streich
8 hours ago




$begingroup$
Which edition is this about?
$endgroup$
– J. A. Streich
8 hours ago




1




1




$begingroup$
@J.A.Streich It looks like they're just asking about general lore, but still a good idea to focus on a specific addition for at least part of the answer.
$endgroup$
– NautArch
8 hours ago




$begingroup$
@J.A.Streich It looks like they're just asking about general lore, but still a good idea to focus on a specific addition for at least part of the answer.
$endgroup$
– NautArch
8 hours ago












$begingroup$
Welcome! You tagged this question with [dungeons-and-dragons] which is used to indicate D&D across all editions. You state you are playing 5e. Does this mean that you are interested in lore from any edition or would you prefer just from 5e?
$endgroup$
– Sdjz
8 hours ago




$begingroup$
Welcome! You tagged this question with [dungeons-and-dragons] which is used to indicate D&D across all editions. You state you are playing 5e. Does this mean that you are interested in lore from any edition or would you prefer just from 5e?
$endgroup$
– Sdjz
8 hours ago




1




1




$begingroup$
Is a player asking to roll a perception check normal procedure at your table?
$endgroup$
– Mark Wells
8 hours ago





$begingroup$
Is a player asking to roll a perception check normal procedure at your table?
$endgroup$
– Mark Wells
8 hours ago





1




1




$begingroup$
So is this the player saying at the table that he heard that dragons smell like lilac, or is this an in-character claim that the character says he heard that?
$endgroup$
– mxyzplk
7 hours ago




$begingroup$
So is this the player saying at the table that he heard that dragons smell like lilac, or is this an in-character claim that the character says he heard that?
$endgroup$
– mxyzplk
7 hours ago










5 Answers
5






active

oldest

votes


















11












$begingroup$

Disclaimer: This answer was written before the addition of the 5e tag. The content below may not be applicable to that specific edition of D&D.




D&D 3.5's Draconomicon actually has several examples of dragons having specific smells. It seems to vary by dragonflight color:



Black - Smells like rotten vegetation and foul water.



Blue - Smells like ozone and sand when upset.



Brass - Smells like hot metal and desert sand.



Bronze - The smell of the sea.



Copper - a "stony" odor.



Gold - Safron and incense.



Green - Chlorine.



Red - Sulfur and pumice.



Silver - The scent of plot devices rain.



White - Couldn't find anything about its scent.



From the classic species, none of them has the smell of lilac. More so, from what is possible to see, it seems that every species of dragon has a different scent, so I would say that no - in general, dragons don't smell like lilac.



Keep in mind: Those are the scents for their regular, dragon form. I wasn't able to find anything regarding their scent either changing or remaining the same when turning into a human.






share|improve this answer











$endgroup$












  • $begingroup$
    The Draconomicon 1 & 2 from 4e also provide a number of scents for both chromatic and metallic dragons, none of them lilac from what I saw.
    $endgroup$
    – Sdjz
    7 hours ago



















2












$begingroup$

As DM, you can decide whether or not dragons have a distinctive smell or not; even if it is written in a book somewhere, you are free to change that.



As DM, you can decide how to determine whether or not a given character would know whether or not a dragon has a distinctive smell, and if so what that smell is. I suggest that, in this case, your best course of action is to treat the suggestion that dragons have a particular smell as the player asking “does my character know of any way to determine a dragon in disguise?” and then ask for an Intelligence check. Which Intelligence check is unclear—unlike previous editions, D&D 5e does not define which Intelligence check covers knowing things about dragons. In previous editions, that would be Arcana, but 5e defines Arcana as dealing with creatures from other planes, so perhaps Nature would be more appropriate. Personally, I would probably let players use either, since dragons are natural creatures that yet have a great deal of arcane relevance, so people trained in either might well know things about them.



And then, as DM, you can decide how hard whatever “tell” they know about is to actually detect. This will probably be a Perception check, since it’s all about recognizing something in your environment, but the DC would be up to you (you could probably make arguments for other skills but most of those are probably not going to be things you can just do inconspicuously when you find yourself in a room of strangers.






share|improve this answer









$endgroup$




















    0












    $begingroup$

    Relevant Questions




    1. Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?



    If you like - there is nothing in the 5e rules to say dragons smell of anything in particular, either in their natural form or their (for good dragons) Change Shape form.



    The broader question is, can a dragon be identified as a dragon through Wisdom (Perception)? Again, that’s up to you, the rules are silent. If you decide they can then it makes as much sense as anything else that it’s through their odour.




    1. Are there actually any dragons in human form in the room? (This one I know the answer to)



    Enough said.




    1. Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this? You would think that dragons would want to keep this a secret.



    Because they grew up in a world where dragons are real.



    I live in a world where giraffes are real and, despite not living in Africa and having direct exposure limited to zoos, I know a fair bit about giraffes. Certainly enough to know a giraffe when I see one and not to confuse it with, say, a grasshopper.



    In a world with dragons (or giraffes), people tell stories and write books (and in world is with giraffes, make nature documentaries) about them. People who live in such a role can know a lot of stuff without being directly exposed to it.



    Dragons probably would want to keep it a secret, however, once the secret is out you can’t put the lilac back in the vase. Dragons probably know that people know and may choose to use rose scented perfume if they want to avoid this way of detection - disadvantage on the check perhaps?



    Naturally, a lot of other things smell of lilacs. Lilacs, for example. A clever dragon might weave lilacs in their hair or heavily subsidise the production of lilac scented perfume so everyone smells of lilacs.



    Of course, what people know to be true may not actually be true - everyone knows dragons smell of lilacs but dragons know the smell of snapdragons (obviously).



    How I would play it



    1. I would decide if dragons can be detected at all by Wisdom (Perception).

    2. Assuming they can I would set a DC.

    3. I would ask the player how their character knows about the lilac smell. An answer like “everybody knows” or “my father told me” etc. means that they know this.

    4. I would decide if their knowledge is true. If so, I’d give them advantage on the check. If not, I’d give disadvantage. I would probably sow doubt from an NPC: “Lilacs! You don’t believe that old wives tale? Next, you’ll be taking us on a giraffe hunt. Ha, ha, ha.”

    5. I would decide if the dragon has taken countermeasures. If so, I would use a contest of Disguise versus Perception.

    6. I would decide who else (if anyone) smells like lilacs.

    7. Player rolls and is told what they perceive.





    share|improve this answer









    $endgroup$




















      0












      $begingroup$

      So the character may indeed believe the smell of lilac is the smell of dragons in human form. Even if it is false. People are full of wrong beliefs.
      I would not have refused the perception roll.



      I'd split it like this:



      1. What is the character's knowledge on nature? I mean is he actually able to know the smell of lilac?

      2. Are there actually lilac near-by?

      3. Fact you know or decide as a rule: Dragon in human form have no special scent.

      4. Don't contradict the player. He is telling you his character's story and belief. Provide the answer his character deserve to get.

      So I'd roll the perception anyway, and if player succeed, has enough nature knowledge, the answer is No, it does not smell anything like lilac.
      If player fail reasonably, you may answer that, yes it indeed smells like lilac.
      If player fail aggravated, it may feel like it smells lilac without any absolute doubt like there are bushes full of it very near.



      Playing with confirmation bias can be fun and a good role-play.





      share








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      $endgroup$




















        -3












        $begingroup$

        Lore




        Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?




        As far as I am aware, there is no lore in any version of Dungeons and Dragons I've played that indicate a dragon polymorphed or not has a distinctive smell. More specifically, I'm am certain there isn't any game mechanics in 5th edition that allows a polymorphed dragon to be identified by smell.



        Game Settings



        The game system is setting independent, even if the setting your player has read about did have lilac or lavender scented dragons doesn't mean that your setting has to. Currently, the 5e rules were written with Forgotten Realms in mind; but expansions have made with Ravnica, Ebberon and Barovia (in Ravenloft)



        RAW




        Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this?




        If it did (and even not), the DM could ask the character have to make a history (Do you know the lore), Nature (Do you understand the nature of Dragon anatomy) or Arcana (Does draconic magic have scent) check (your choice) if they think the character might know this information. They would do this before they do the perception check you ask for.



        Note: Players shouldn't ask to roll checks. They tell you what they want to do, and you tell them if a check is necessary.



        Fun with Meta



        I personally, would love using the meta belief to my advantage as a DM. "Roll a history check." They roll poorly, below the DC you set on that information. "Yes, you are positively convinced that dragons smell like lilac." They make a perception check, to see if the person smells, and succeeds.



        • If they aren't a dragon, I make them smell like lilac, so the character thinks they are.

        • If they are a dragon, I make them smell of overly burnt sandalwood incense.





        share|improve this answer











        $endgroup$








        • 1




          $begingroup$
          History is a very strange choice here; it should be Arcana or Nature. Moreover, failure on Int checks is “you don’t know,” not “you know this fact that isn’t actually true.” Your “fun with meta” suggestion changes the definition of knowledge skills and unless it has been established up-front that this is how they behave in your games, is only “fun” because the DM is basically cheating the players of what they have been given to understand is the way the rules work. Furthermore, personal experience tells me it just causes strife and bad feelings, while doing nothing to improve the game.
          $endgroup$
          – KRyan
          8 hours ago






        • 2




          $begingroup$
          If the character is convinced that dragons smell like lilacs, a better (less messing-with-the-player) use for the knowledge check would be to determine if they're right.
          $endgroup$
          – Mark Wells
          8 hours ago













        Your Answer








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        5 Answers
        5






        active

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        5 Answers
        5






        active

        oldest

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        active

        oldest

        votes






        active

        oldest

        votes









        11












        $begingroup$

        Disclaimer: This answer was written before the addition of the 5e tag. The content below may not be applicable to that specific edition of D&D.




        D&D 3.5's Draconomicon actually has several examples of dragons having specific smells. It seems to vary by dragonflight color:



        Black - Smells like rotten vegetation and foul water.



        Blue - Smells like ozone and sand when upset.



        Brass - Smells like hot metal and desert sand.



        Bronze - The smell of the sea.



        Copper - a "stony" odor.



        Gold - Safron and incense.



        Green - Chlorine.



        Red - Sulfur and pumice.



        Silver - The scent of plot devices rain.



        White - Couldn't find anything about its scent.



        From the classic species, none of them has the smell of lilac. More so, from what is possible to see, it seems that every species of dragon has a different scent, so I would say that no - in general, dragons don't smell like lilac.



        Keep in mind: Those are the scents for their regular, dragon form. I wasn't able to find anything regarding their scent either changing or remaining the same when turning into a human.






        share|improve this answer











        $endgroup$












        • $begingroup$
          The Draconomicon 1 & 2 from 4e also provide a number of scents for both chromatic and metallic dragons, none of them lilac from what I saw.
          $endgroup$
          – Sdjz
          7 hours ago
















        11












        $begingroup$

        Disclaimer: This answer was written before the addition of the 5e tag. The content below may not be applicable to that specific edition of D&D.




        D&D 3.5's Draconomicon actually has several examples of dragons having specific smells. It seems to vary by dragonflight color:



        Black - Smells like rotten vegetation and foul water.



        Blue - Smells like ozone and sand when upset.



        Brass - Smells like hot metal and desert sand.



        Bronze - The smell of the sea.



        Copper - a "stony" odor.



        Gold - Safron and incense.



        Green - Chlorine.



        Red - Sulfur and pumice.



        Silver - The scent of plot devices rain.



        White - Couldn't find anything about its scent.



        From the classic species, none of them has the smell of lilac. More so, from what is possible to see, it seems that every species of dragon has a different scent, so I would say that no - in general, dragons don't smell like lilac.



        Keep in mind: Those are the scents for their regular, dragon form. I wasn't able to find anything regarding their scent either changing or remaining the same when turning into a human.






        share|improve this answer











        $endgroup$












        • $begingroup$
          The Draconomicon 1 & 2 from 4e also provide a number of scents for both chromatic and metallic dragons, none of them lilac from what I saw.
          $endgroup$
          – Sdjz
          7 hours ago














        11












        11








        11





        $begingroup$

        Disclaimer: This answer was written before the addition of the 5e tag. The content below may not be applicable to that specific edition of D&D.




        D&D 3.5's Draconomicon actually has several examples of dragons having specific smells. It seems to vary by dragonflight color:



        Black - Smells like rotten vegetation and foul water.



        Blue - Smells like ozone and sand when upset.



        Brass - Smells like hot metal and desert sand.



        Bronze - The smell of the sea.



        Copper - a "stony" odor.



        Gold - Safron and incense.



        Green - Chlorine.



        Red - Sulfur and pumice.



        Silver - The scent of plot devices rain.



        White - Couldn't find anything about its scent.



        From the classic species, none of them has the smell of lilac. More so, from what is possible to see, it seems that every species of dragon has a different scent, so I would say that no - in general, dragons don't smell like lilac.



        Keep in mind: Those are the scents for their regular, dragon form. I wasn't able to find anything regarding their scent either changing or remaining the same when turning into a human.






        share|improve this answer











        $endgroup$



        Disclaimer: This answer was written before the addition of the 5e tag. The content below may not be applicable to that specific edition of D&D.




        D&D 3.5's Draconomicon actually has several examples of dragons having specific smells. It seems to vary by dragonflight color:



        Black - Smells like rotten vegetation and foul water.



        Blue - Smells like ozone and sand when upset.



        Brass - Smells like hot metal and desert sand.



        Bronze - The smell of the sea.



        Copper - a "stony" odor.



        Gold - Safron and incense.



        Green - Chlorine.



        Red - Sulfur and pumice.



        Silver - The scent of plot devices rain.



        White - Couldn't find anything about its scent.



        From the classic species, none of them has the smell of lilac. More so, from what is possible to see, it seems that every species of dragon has a different scent, so I would say that no - in general, dragons don't smell like lilac.



        Keep in mind: Those are the scents for their regular, dragon form. I wasn't able to find anything regarding their scent either changing or remaining the same when turning into a human.







        share|improve this answer














        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer








        edited 7 hours ago

























        answered 8 hours ago









        T. SarT. Sar

        8,4874 gold badges33 silver badges77 bronze badges




        8,4874 gold badges33 silver badges77 bronze badges











        • $begingroup$
          The Draconomicon 1 & 2 from 4e also provide a number of scents for both chromatic and metallic dragons, none of them lilac from what I saw.
          $endgroup$
          – Sdjz
          7 hours ago

















        • $begingroup$
          The Draconomicon 1 & 2 from 4e also provide a number of scents for both chromatic and metallic dragons, none of them lilac from what I saw.
          $endgroup$
          – Sdjz
          7 hours ago
















        $begingroup$
        The Draconomicon 1 & 2 from 4e also provide a number of scents for both chromatic and metallic dragons, none of them lilac from what I saw.
        $endgroup$
        – Sdjz
        7 hours ago





        $begingroup$
        The Draconomicon 1 & 2 from 4e also provide a number of scents for both chromatic and metallic dragons, none of them lilac from what I saw.
        $endgroup$
        – Sdjz
        7 hours ago














        2












        $begingroup$

        As DM, you can decide whether or not dragons have a distinctive smell or not; even if it is written in a book somewhere, you are free to change that.



        As DM, you can decide how to determine whether or not a given character would know whether or not a dragon has a distinctive smell, and if so what that smell is. I suggest that, in this case, your best course of action is to treat the suggestion that dragons have a particular smell as the player asking “does my character know of any way to determine a dragon in disguise?” and then ask for an Intelligence check. Which Intelligence check is unclear—unlike previous editions, D&D 5e does not define which Intelligence check covers knowing things about dragons. In previous editions, that would be Arcana, but 5e defines Arcana as dealing with creatures from other planes, so perhaps Nature would be more appropriate. Personally, I would probably let players use either, since dragons are natural creatures that yet have a great deal of arcane relevance, so people trained in either might well know things about them.



        And then, as DM, you can decide how hard whatever “tell” they know about is to actually detect. This will probably be a Perception check, since it’s all about recognizing something in your environment, but the DC would be up to you (you could probably make arguments for other skills but most of those are probably not going to be things you can just do inconspicuously when you find yourself in a room of strangers.






        share|improve this answer









        $endgroup$

















          2












          $begingroup$

          As DM, you can decide whether or not dragons have a distinctive smell or not; even if it is written in a book somewhere, you are free to change that.



          As DM, you can decide how to determine whether or not a given character would know whether or not a dragon has a distinctive smell, and if so what that smell is. I suggest that, in this case, your best course of action is to treat the suggestion that dragons have a particular smell as the player asking “does my character know of any way to determine a dragon in disguise?” and then ask for an Intelligence check. Which Intelligence check is unclear—unlike previous editions, D&D 5e does not define which Intelligence check covers knowing things about dragons. In previous editions, that would be Arcana, but 5e defines Arcana as dealing with creatures from other planes, so perhaps Nature would be more appropriate. Personally, I would probably let players use either, since dragons are natural creatures that yet have a great deal of arcane relevance, so people trained in either might well know things about them.



          And then, as DM, you can decide how hard whatever “tell” they know about is to actually detect. This will probably be a Perception check, since it’s all about recognizing something in your environment, but the DC would be up to you (you could probably make arguments for other skills but most of those are probably not going to be things you can just do inconspicuously when you find yourself in a room of strangers.






          share|improve this answer









          $endgroup$















            2












            2








            2





            $begingroup$

            As DM, you can decide whether or not dragons have a distinctive smell or not; even if it is written in a book somewhere, you are free to change that.



            As DM, you can decide how to determine whether or not a given character would know whether or not a dragon has a distinctive smell, and if so what that smell is. I suggest that, in this case, your best course of action is to treat the suggestion that dragons have a particular smell as the player asking “does my character know of any way to determine a dragon in disguise?” and then ask for an Intelligence check. Which Intelligence check is unclear—unlike previous editions, D&D 5e does not define which Intelligence check covers knowing things about dragons. In previous editions, that would be Arcana, but 5e defines Arcana as dealing with creatures from other planes, so perhaps Nature would be more appropriate. Personally, I would probably let players use either, since dragons are natural creatures that yet have a great deal of arcane relevance, so people trained in either might well know things about them.



            And then, as DM, you can decide how hard whatever “tell” they know about is to actually detect. This will probably be a Perception check, since it’s all about recognizing something in your environment, but the DC would be up to you (you could probably make arguments for other skills but most of those are probably not going to be things you can just do inconspicuously when you find yourself in a room of strangers.






            share|improve this answer









            $endgroup$



            As DM, you can decide whether or not dragons have a distinctive smell or not; even if it is written in a book somewhere, you are free to change that.



            As DM, you can decide how to determine whether or not a given character would know whether or not a dragon has a distinctive smell, and if so what that smell is. I suggest that, in this case, your best course of action is to treat the suggestion that dragons have a particular smell as the player asking “does my character know of any way to determine a dragon in disguise?” and then ask for an Intelligence check. Which Intelligence check is unclear—unlike previous editions, D&D 5e does not define which Intelligence check covers knowing things about dragons. In previous editions, that would be Arcana, but 5e defines Arcana as dealing with creatures from other planes, so perhaps Nature would be more appropriate. Personally, I would probably let players use either, since dragons are natural creatures that yet have a great deal of arcane relevance, so people trained in either might well know things about them.



            And then, as DM, you can decide how hard whatever “tell” they know about is to actually detect. This will probably be a Perception check, since it’s all about recognizing something in your environment, but the DC would be up to you (you could probably make arguments for other skills but most of those are probably not going to be things you can just do inconspicuously when you find yourself in a room of strangers.







            share|improve this answer












            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer










            answered 7 hours ago









            KRyanKRyan

            232k34 gold badges586 silver badges982 bronze badges




            232k34 gold badges586 silver badges982 bronze badges





















                0












                $begingroup$

                Relevant Questions




                1. Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?



                If you like - there is nothing in the 5e rules to say dragons smell of anything in particular, either in their natural form or their (for good dragons) Change Shape form.



                The broader question is, can a dragon be identified as a dragon through Wisdom (Perception)? Again, that’s up to you, the rules are silent. If you decide they can then it makes as much sense as anything else that it’s through their odour.




                1. Are there actually any dragons in human form in the room? (This one I know the answer to)



                Enough said.




                1. Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this? You would think that dragons would want to keep this a secret.



                Because they grew up in a world where dragons are real.



                I live in a world where giraffes are real and, despite not living in Africa and having direct exposure limited to zoos, I know a fair bit about giraffes. Certainly enough to know a giraffe when I see one and not to confuse it with, say, a grasshopper.



                In a world with dragons (or giraffes), people tell stories and write books (and in world is with giraffes, make nature documentaries) about them. People who live in such a role can know a lot of stuff without being directly exposed to it.



                Dragons probably would want to keep it a secret, however, once the secret is out you can’t put the lilac back in the vase. Dragons probably know that people know and may choose to use rose scented perfume if they want to avoid this way of detection - disadvantage on the check perhaps?



                Naturally, a lot of other things smell of lilacs. Lilacs, for example. A clever dragon might weave lilacs in their hair or heavily subsidise the production of lilac scented perfume so everyone smells of lilacs.



                Of course, what people know to be true may not actually be true - everyone knows dragons smell of lilacs but dragons know the smell of snapdragons (obviously).



                How I would play it



                1. I would decide if dragons can be detected at all by Wisdom (Perception).

                2. Assuming they can I would set a DC.

                3. I would ask the player how their character knows about the lilac smell. An answer like “everybody knows” or “my father told me” etc. means that they know this.

                4. I would decide if their knowledge is true. If so, I’d give them advantage on the check. If not, I’d give disadvantage. I would probably sow doubt from an NPC: “Lilacs! You don’t believe that old wives tale? Next, you’ll be taking us on a giraffe hunt. Ha, ha, ha.”

                5. I would decide if the dragon has taken countermeasures. If so, I would use a contest of Disguise versus Perception.

                6. I would decide who else (if anyone) smells like lilacs.

                7. Player rolls and is told what they perceive.





                share|improve this answer









                $endgroup$

















                  0












                  $begingroup$

                  Relevant Questions




                  1. Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?



                  If you like - there is nothing in the 5e rules to say dragons smell of anything in particular, either in their natural form or their (for good dragons) Change Shape form.



                  The broader question is, can a dragon be identified as a dragon through Wisdom (Perception)? Again, that’s up to you, the rules are silent. If you decide they can then it makes as much sense as anything else that it’s through their odour.




                  1. Are there actually any dragons in human form in the room? (This one I know the answer to)



                  Enough said.




                  1. Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this? You would think that dragons would want to keep this a secret.



                  Because they grew up in a world where dragons are real.



                  I live in a world where giraffes are real and, despite not living in Africa and having direct exposure limited to zoos, I know a fair bit about giraffes. Certainly enough to know a giraffe when I see one and not to confuse it with, say, a grasshopper.



                  In a world with dragons (or giraffes), people tell stories and write books (and in world is with giraffes, make nature documentaries) about them. People who live in such a role can know a lot of stuff without being directly exposed to it.



                  Dragons probably would want to keep it a secret, however, once the secret is out you can’t put the lilac back in the vase. Dragons probably know that people know and may choose to use rose scented perfume if they want to avoid this way of detection - disadvantage on the check perhaps?



                  Naturally, a lot of other things smell of lilacs. Lilacs, for example. A clever dragon might weave lilacs in their hair or heavily subsidise the production of lilac scented perfume so everyone smells of lilacs.



                  Of course, what people know to be true may not actually be true - everyone knows dragons smell of lilacs but dragons know the smell of snapdragons (obviously).



                  How I would play it



                  1. I would decide if dragons can be detected at all by Wisdom (Perception).

                  2. Assuming they can I would set a DC.

                  3. I would ask the player how their character knows about the lilac smell. An answer like “everybody knows” or “my father told me” etc. means that they know this.

                  4. I would decide if their knowledge is true. If so, I’d give them advantage on the check. If not, I’d give disadvantage. I would probably sow doubt from an NPC: “Lilacs! You don’t believe that old wives tale? Next, you’ll be taking us on a giraffe hunt. Ha, ha, ha.”

                  5. I would decide if the dragon has taken countermeasures. If so, I would use a contest of Disguise versus Perception.

                  6. I would decide who else (if anyone) smells like lilacs.

                  7. Player rolls and is told what they perceive.





                  share|improve this answer









                  $endgroup$















                    0












                    0








                    0





                    $begingroup$

                    Relevant Questions




                    1. Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?



                    If you like - there is nothing in the 5e rules to say dragons smell of anything in particular, either in their natural form or their (for good dragons) Change Shape form.



                    The broader question is, can a dragon be identified as a dragon through Wisdom (Perception)? Again, that’s up to you, the rules are silent. If you decide they can then it makes as much sense as anything else that it’s through their odour.




                    1. Are there actually any dragons in human form in the room? (This one I know the answer to)



                    Enough said.




                    1. Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this? You would think that dragons would want to keep this a secret.



                    Because they grew up in a world where dragons are real.



                    I live in a world where giraffes are real and, despite not living in Africa and having direct exposure limited to zoos, I know a fair bit about giraffes. Certainly enough to know a giraffe when I see one and not to confuse it with, say, a grasshopper.



                    In a world with dragons (or giraffes), people tell stories and write books (and in world is with giraffes, make nature documentaries) about them. People who live in such a role can know a lot of stuff without being directly exposed to it.



                    Dragons probably would want to keep it a secret, however, once the secret is out you can’t put the lilac back in the vase. Dragons probably know that people know and may choose to use rose scented perfume if they want to avoid this way of detection - disadvantage on the check perhaps?



                    Naturally, a lot of other things smell of lilacs. Lilacs, for example. A clever dragon might weave lilacs in their hair or heavily subsidise the production of lilac scented perfume so everyone smells of lilacs.



                    Of course, what people know to be true may not actually be true - everyone knows dragons smell of lilacs but dragons know the smell of snapdragons (obviously).



                    How I would play it



                    1. I would decide if dragons can be detected at all by Wisdom (Perception).

                    2. Assuming they can I would set a DC.

                    3. I would ask the player how their character knows about the lilac smell. An answer like “everybody knows” or “my father told me” etc. means that they know this.

                    4. I would decide if their knowledge is true. If so, I’d give them advantage on the check. If not, I’d give disadvantage. I would probably sow doubt from an NPC: “Lilacs! You don’t believe that old wives tale? Next, you’ll be taking us on a giraffe hunt. Ha, ha, ha.”

                    5. I would decide if the dragon has taken countermeasures. If so, I would use a contest of Disguise versus Perception.

                    6. I would decide who else (if anyone) smells like lilacs.

                    7. Player rolls and is told what they perceive.





                    share|improve this answer









                    $endgroup$



                    Relevant Questions




                    1. Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?



                    If you like - there is nothing in the 5e rules to say dragons smell of anything in particular, either in their natural form or their (for good dragons) Change Shape form.



                    The broader question is, can a dragon be identified as a dragon through Wisdom (Perception)? Again, that’s up to you, the rules are silent. If you decide they can then it makes as much sense as anything else that it’s through their odour.




                    1. Are there actually any dragons in human form in the room? (This one I know the answer to)



                    Enough said.




                    1. Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this? You would think that dragons would want to keep this a secret.



                    Because they grew up in a world where dragons are real.



                    I live in a world where giraffes are real and, despite not living in Africa and having direct exposure limited to zoos, I know a fair bit about giraffes. Certainly enough to know a giraffe when I see one and not to confuse it with, say, a grasshopper.



                    In a world with dragons (or giraffes), people tell stories and write books (and in world is with giraffes, make nature documentaries) about them. People who live in such a role can know a lot of stuff without being directly exposed to it.



                    Dragons probably would want to keep it a secret, however, once the secret is out you can’t put the lilac back in the vase. Dragons probably know that people know and may choose to use rose scented perfume if they want to avoid this way of detection - disadvantage on the check perhaps?



                    Naturally, a lot of other things smell of lilacs. Lilacs, for example. A clever dragon might weave lilacs in their hair or heavily subsidise the production of lilac scented perfume so everyone smells of lilacs.



                    Of course, what people know to be true may not actually be true - everyone knows dragons smell of lilacs but dragons know the smell of snapdragons (obviously).



                    How I would play it



                    1. I would decide if dragons can be detected at all by Wisdom (Perception).

                    2. Assuming they can I would set a DC.

                    3. I would ask the player how their character knows about the lilac smell. An answer like “everybody knows” or “my father told me” etc. means that they know this.

                    4. I would decide if their knowledge is true. If so, I’d give them advantage on the check. If not, I’d give disadvantage. I would probably sow doubt from an NPC: “Lilacs! You don’t believe that old wives tale? Next, you’ll be taking us on a giraffe hunt. Ha, ha, ha.”

                    5. I would decide if the dragon has taken countermeasures. If so, I would use a contest of Disguise versus Perception.

                    6. I would decide who else (if anyone) smells like lilacs.

                    7. Player rolls and is told what they perceive.






                    share|improve this answer












                    share|improve this answer



                    share|improve this answer










                    answered 21 mins ago









                    Dale MDale M

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                        0












                        $begingroup$

                        So the character may indeed believe the smell of lilac is the smell of dragons in human form. Even if it is false. People are full of wrong beliefs.
                        I would not have refused the perception roll.



                        I'd split it like this:



                        1. What is the character's knowledge on nature? I mean is he actually able to know the smell of lilac?

                        2. Are there actually lilac near-by?

                        3. Fact you know or decide as a rule: Dragon in human form have no special scent.

                        4. Don't contradict the player. He is telling you his character's story and belief. Provide the answer his character deserve to get.

                        So I'd roll the perception anyway, and if player succeed, has enough nature knowledge, the answer is No, it does not smell anything like lilac.
                        If player fail reasonably, you may answer that, yes it indeed smells like lilac.
                        If player fail aggravated, it may feel like it smells lilac without any absolute doubt like there are bushes full of it very near.



                        Playing with confirmation bias can be fun and a good role-play.





                        share








                        New contributor



                        Léa Gris is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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                        $endgroup$

















                          0












                          $begingroup$

                          So the character may indeed believe the smell of lilac is the smell of dragons in human form. Even if it is false. People are full of wrong beliefs.
                          I would not have refused the perception roll.



                          I'd split it like this:



                          1. What is the character's knowledge on nature? I mean is he actually able to know the smell of lilac?

                          2. Are there actually lilac near-by?

                          3. Fact you know or decide as a rule: Dragon in human form have no special scent.

                          4. Don't contradict the player. He is telling you his character's story and belief. Provide the answer his character deserve to get.

                          So I'd roll the perception anyway, and if player succeed, has enough nature knowledge, the answer is No, it does not smell anything like lilac.
                          If player fail reasonably, you may answer that, yes it indeed smells like lilac.
                          If player fail aggravated, it may feel like it smells lilac without any absolute doubt like there are bushes full of it very near.



                          Playing with confirmation bias can be fun and a good role-play.





                          share








                          New contributor



                          Léa Gris is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                          Check out our Code of Conduct.





                          $endgroup$















                            0












                            0








                            0





                            $begingroup$

                            So the character may indeed believe the smell of lilac is the smell of dragons in human form. Even if it is false. People are full of wrong beliefs.
                            I would not have refused the perception roll.



                            I'd split it like this:



                            1. What is the character's knowledge on nature? I mean is he actually able to know the smell of lilac?

                            2. Are there actually lilac near-by?

                            3. Fact you know or decide as a rule: Dragon in human form have no special scent.

                            4. Don't contradict the player. He is telling you his character's story and belief. Provide the answer his character deserve to get.

                            So I'd roll the perception anyway, and if player succeed, has enough nature knowledge, the answer is No, it does not smell anything like lilac.
                            If player fail reasonably, you may answer that, yes it indeed smells like lilac.
                            If player fail aggravated, it may feel like it smells lilac without any absolute doubt like there are bushes full of it very near.



                            Playing with confirmation bias can be fun and a good role-play.





                            share








                            New contributor



                            Léa Gris is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                            Check out our Code of Conduct.





                            $endgroup$



                            So the character may indeed believe the smell of lilac is the smell of dragons in human form. Even if it is false. People are full of wrong beliefs.
                            I would not have refused the perception roll.



                            I'd split it like this:



                            1. What is the character's knowledge on nature? I mean is he actually able to know the smell of lilac?

                            2. Are there actually lilac near-by?

                            3. Fact you know or decide as a rule: Dragon in human form have no special scent.

                            4. Don't contradict the player. He is telling you his character's story and belief. Provide the answer his character deserve to get.

                            So I'd roll the perception anyway, and if player succeed, has enough nature knowledge, the answer is No, it does not smell anything like lilac.
                            If player fail reasonably, you may answer that, yes it indeed smells like lilac.
                            If player fail aggravated, it may feel like it smells lilac without any absolute doubt like there are bushes full of it very near.



                            Playing with confirmation bias can be fun and a good role-play.






                            share








                            New contributor



                            Léa Gris is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                            Check out our Code of Conduct.







                            share


                            share






                            New contributor



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                            answered 5 mins ago









                            Léa GrisLéa Gris

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                            New contributor



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                            New contributor




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                                -3












                                $begingroup$

                                Lore




                                Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?




                                As far as I am aware, there is no lore in any version of Dungeons and Dragons I've played that indicate a dragon polymorphed or not has a distinctive smell. More specifically, I'm am certain there isn't any game mechanics in 5th edition that allows a polymorphed dragon to be identified by smell.



                                Game Settings



                                The game system is setting independent, even if the setting your player has read about did have lilac or lavender scented dragons doesn't mean that your setting has to. Currently, the 5e rules were written with Forgotten Realms in mind; but expansions have made with Ravnica, Ebberon and Barovia (in Ravenloft)



                                RAW




                                Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this?




                                If it did (and even not), the DM could ask the character have to make a history (Do you know the lore), Nature (Do you understand the nature of Dragon anatomy) or Arcana (Does draconic magic have scent) check (your choice) if they think the character might know this information. They would do this before they do the perception check you ask for.



                                Note: Players shouldn't ask to roll checks. They tell you what they want to do, and you tell them if a check is necessary.



                                Fun with Meta



                                I personally, would love using the meta belief to my advantage as a DM. "Roll a history check." They roll poorly, below the DC you set on that information. "Yes, you are positively convinced that dragons smell like lilac." They make a perception check, to see if the person smells, and succeeds.



                                • If they aren't a dragon, I make them smell like lilac, so the character thinks they are.

                                • If they are a dragon, I make them smell of overly burnt sandalwood incense.





                                share|improve this answer











                                $endgroup$








                                • 1




                                  $begingroup$
                                  History is a very strange choice here; it should be Arcana or Nature. Moreover, failure on Int checks is “you don’t know,” not “you know this fact that isn’t actually true.” Your “fun with meta” suggestion changes the definition of knowledge skills and unless it has been established up-front that this is how they behave in your games, is only “fun” because the DM is basically cheating the players of what they have been given to understand is the way the rules work. Furthermore, personal experience tells me it just causes strife and bad feelings, while doing nothing to improve the game.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – KRyan
                                  8 hours ago






                                • 2




                                  $begingroup$
                                  If the character is convinced that dragons smell like lilacs, a better (less messing-with-the-player) use for the knowledge check would be to determine if they're right.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – Mark Wells
                                  8 hours ago















                                -3












                                $begingroup$

                                Lore




                                Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?




                                As far as I am aware, there is no lore in any version of Dungeons and Dragons I've played that indicate a dragon polymorphed or not has a distinctive smell. More specifically, I'm am certain there isn't any game mechanics in 5th edition that allows a polymorphed dragon to be identified by smell.



                                Game Settings



                                The game system is setting independent, even if the setting your player has read about did have lilac or lavender scented dragons doesn't mean that your setting has to. Currently, the 5e rules were written with Forgotten Realms in mind; but expansions have made with Ravnica, Ebberon and Barovia (in Ravenloft)



                                RAW




                                Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this?




                                If it did (and even not), the DM could ask the character have to make a history (Do you know the lore), Nature (Do you understand the nature of Dragon anatomy) or Arcana (Does draconic magic have scent) check (your choice) if they think the character might know this information. They would do this before they do the perception check you ask for.



                                Note: Players shouldn't ask to roll checks. They tell you what they want to do, and you tell them if a check is necessary.



                                Fun with Meta



                                I personally, would love using the meta belief to my advantage as a DM. "Roll a history check." They roll poorly, below the DC you set on that information. "Yes, you are positively convinced that dragons smell like lilac." They make a perception check, to see if the person smells, and succeeds.



                                • If they aren't a dragon, I make them smell like lilac, so the character thinks they are.

                                • If they are a dragon, I make them smell of overly burnt sandalwood incense.





                                share|improve this answer











                                $endgroup$








                                • 1




                                  $begingroup$
                                  History is a very strange choice here; it should be Arcana or Nature. Moreover, failure on Int checks is “you don’t know,” not “you know this fact that isn’t actually true.” Your “fun with meta” suggestion changes the definition of knowledge skills and unless it has been established up-front that this is how they behave in your games, is only “fun” because the DM is basically cheating the players of what they have been given to understand is the way the rules work. Furthermore, personal experience tells me it just causes strife and bad feelings, while doing nothing to improve the game.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – KRyan
                                  8 hours ago






                                • 2




                                  $begingroup$
                                  If the character is convinced that dragons smell like lilacs, a better (less messing-with-the-player) use for the knowledge check would be to determine if they're right.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – Mark Wells
                                  8 hours ago













                                -3












                                -3








                                -3





                                $begingroup$

                                Lore




                                Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?




                                As far as I am aware, there is no lore in any version of Dungeons and Dragons I've played that indicate a dragon polymorphed or not has a distinctive smell. More specifically, I'm am certain there isn't any game mechanics in 5th edition that allows a polymorphed dragon to be identified by smell.



                                Game Settings



                                The game system is setting independent, even if the setting your player has read about did have lilac or lavender scented dragons doesn't mean that your setting has to. Currently, the 5e rules were written with Forgotten Realms in mind; but expansions have made with Ravnica, Ebberon and Barovia (in Ravenloft)



                                RAW




                                Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this?




                                If it did (and even not), the DM could ask the character have to make a history (Do you know the lore), Nature (Do you understand the nature of Dragon anatomy) or Arcana (Does draconic magic have scent) check (your choice) if they think the character might know this information. They would do this before they do the perception check you ask for.



                                Note: Players shouldn't ask to roll checks. They tell you what they want to do, and you tell them if a check is necessary.



                                Fun with Meta



                                I personally, would love using the meta belief to my advantage as a DM. "Roll a history check." They roll poorly, below the DC you set on that information. "Yes, you are positively convinced that dragons smell like lilac." They make a perception check, to see if the person smells, and succeeds.



                                • If they aren't a dragon, I make them smell like lilac, so the character thinks they are.

                                • If they are a dragon, I make them smell of overly burnt sandalwood incense.





                                share|improve this answer











                                $endgroup$



                                Lore




                                Do dragons in human form have a smell that they can be identified by?




                                As far as I am aware, there is no lore in any version of Dungeons and Dragons I've played that indicate a dragon polymorphed or not has a distinctive smell. More specifically, I'm am certain there isn't any game mechanics in 5th edition that allows a polymorphed dragon to be identified by smell.



                                Game Settings



                                The game system is setting independent, even if the setting your player has read about did have lilac or lavender scented dragons doesn't mean that your setting has to. Currently, the 5e rules were written with Forgotten Realms in mind; but expansions have made with Ravnica, Ebberon and Barovia (in Ravenloft)



                                RAW




                                Even if dragons in human form do have a smell, then how would the character know this?




                                If it did (and even not), the DM could ask the character have to make a history (Do you know the lore), Nature (Do you understand the nature of Dragon anatomy) or Arcana (Does draconic magic have scent) check (your choice) if they think the character might know this information. They would do this before they do the perception check you ask for.



                                Note: Players shouldn't ask to roll checks. They tell you what they want to do, and you tell them if a check is necessary.



                                Fun with Meta



                                I personally, would love using the meta belief to my advantage as a DM. "Roll a history check." They roll poorly, below the DC you set on that information. "Yes, you are positively convinced that dragons smell like lilac." They make a perception check, to see if the person smells, and succeeds.



                                • If they aren't a dragon, I make them smell like lilac, so the character thinks they are.

                                • If they are a dragon, I make them smell of overly burnt sandalwood incense.






                                share|improve this answer














                                share|improve this answer



                                share|improve this answer








                                edited 8 hours ago

























                                answered 8 hours ago









                                J. A. StreichJ. A. Streich

                                27.3k2 gold badges80 silver badges135 bronze badges




                                27.3k2 gold badges80 silver badges135 bronze badges







                                • 1




                                  $begingroup$
                                  History is a very strange choice here; it should be Arcana or Nature. Moreover, failure on Int checks is “you don’t know,” not “you know this fact that isn’t actually true.” Your “fun with meta” suggestion changes the definition of knowledge skills and unless it has been established up-front that this is how they behave in your games, is only “fun” because the DM is basically cheating the players of what they have been given to understand is the way the rules work. Furthermore, personal experience tells me it just causes strife and bad feelings, while doing nothing to improve the game.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – KRyan
                                  8 hours ago






                                • 2




                                  $begingroup$
                                  If the character is convinced that dragons smell like lilacs, a better (less messing-with-the-player) use for the knowledge check would be to determine if they're right.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – Mark Wells
                                  8 hours ago












                                • 1




                                  $begingroup$
                                  History is a very strange choice here; it should be Arcana or Nature. Moreover, failure on Int checks is “you don’t know,” not “you know this fact that isn’t actually true.” Your “fun with meta” suggestion changes the definition of knowledge skills and unless it has been established up-front that this is how they behave in your games, is only “fun” because the DM is basically cheating the players of what they have been given to understand is the way the rules work. Furthermore, personal experience tells me it just causes strife and bad feelings, while doing nothing to improve the game.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – KRyan
                                  8 hours ago






                                • 2




                                  $begingroup$
                                  If the character is convinced that dragons smell like lilacs, a better (less messing-with-the-player) use for the knowledge check would be to determine if they're right.
                                  $endgroup$
                                  – Mark Wells
                                  8 hours ago







                                1




                                1




                                $begingroup$
                                History is a very strange choice here; it should be Arcana or Nature. Moreover, failure on Int checks is “you don’t know,” not “you know this fact that isn’t actually true.” Your “fun with meta” suggestion changes the definition of knowledge skills and unless it has been established up-front that this is how they behave in your games, is only “fun” because the DM is basically cheating the players of what they have been given to understand is the way the rules work. Furthermore, personal experience tells me it just causes strife and bad feelings, while doing nothing to improve the game.
                                $endgroup$
                                – KRyan
                                8 hours ago




                                $begingroup$
                                History is a very strange choice here; it should be Arcana or Nature. Moreover, failure on Int checks is “you don’t know,” not “you know this fact that isn’t actually true.” Your “fun with meta” suggestion changes the definition of knowledge skills and unless it has been established up-front that this is how they behave in your games, is only “fun” because the DM is basically cheating the players of what they have been given to understand is the way the rules work. Furthermore, personal experience tells me it just causes strife and bad feelings, while doing nothing to improve the game.
                                $endgroup$
                                – KRyan
                                8 hours ago




                                2




                                2




                                $begingroup$
                                If the character is convinced that dragons smell like lilacs, a better (less messing-with-the-player) use for the knowledge check would be to determine if they're right.
                                $endgroup$
                                – Mark Wells
                                8 hours ago




                                $begingroup$
                                If the character is convinced that dragons smell like lilacs, a better (less messing-with-the-player) use for the knowledge check would be to determine if they're right.
                                $endgroup$
                                – Mark Wells
                                8 hours ago










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