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GMRES vs Newton-GMRES for Solving nonlinear PDE's


Newton-Raphson method for nonlinear partial differential equationsSolving a nonlinear algebraic system that includes a linear termIs it possible to solve nonlinear PDEs without using Newton-Raphson iteration?Solving a system of nonlinear equations with an ODE solver is faster than with the Newton method?Newton iteration applied to nonlinear PDESolving this nonlinear system of equationsNumerically solving a system of stiff nonlinear PDEsNewton method for a nonlinear system of time-independent PDEsNonlinear system with diagonal nonlinearityResidual value goes to NaN while solving a system of nonlinear equations













1












$begingroup$


Often when numerically solving nonlinear PDE's using method of lines approach with an implicit integrator a system of nonlinear equations have to be solved.
To be more specific, let's say we have simple backward Euler method:
beginalign
y^n=y^n+1-h f(y^n+1,t)= G(y^n+1,t)
endalign

From the available literature, it seems the most common approach is using an Newton-GMRES method to solve the nonlinear system, especially if it is stiff.
As far as I can understand GMRES is used because it is a matrix-free method and so also works with vector functions which is good when approximating the Jacobian with finite differences.



My question is then, why not just use the GMRES to solve the initial problem?
I see no reason why GMRES couldn't solve this for $y^n+1$ when for the Newton-GMRES we solve the system:
beginalign
H(y^n+1_k) &= y^n+1_k-y^n-h f(y^n+1_k,t)rightarrow 0 text for krightarrow infty\
Jv &simeq fracH(y^n+1_k+epsilon v)-H(y^n+1_k))epsilon simeq -H(y^n+1_k)\
y^n+1_k+1&=y^n+1_k+v
endalign

where the GMRES is used for the second part to find $v$. I don't see why solving for $v$ with GMRES followed by the Newton step should be easier/better than solving the general system in the top for $y^n+1$ using GMRES? Does the finite difference approximation to the Jacobian have better properties compared the the general system $y^n=G(y^n+1,t)$?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$
















    1












    $begingroup$


    Often when numerically solving nonlinear PDE's using method of lines approach with an implicit integrator a system of nonlinear equations have to be solved.
    To be more specific, let's say we have simple backward Euler method:
    beginalign
    y^n=y^n+1-h f(y^n+1,t)= G(y^n+1,t)
    endalign

    From the available literature, it seems the most common approach is using an Newton-GMRES method to solve the nonlinear system, especially if it is stiff.
    As far as I can understand GMRES is used because it is a matrix-free method and so also works with vector functions which is good when approximating the Jacobian with finite differences.



    My question is then, why not just use the GMRES to solve the initial problem?
    I see no reason why GMRES couldn't solve this for $y^n+1$ when for the Newton-GMRES we solve the system:
    beginalign
    H(y^n+1_k) &= y^n+1_k-y^n-h f(y^n+1_k,t)rightarrow 0 text for krightarrow infty\
    Jv &simeq fracH(y^n+1_k+epsilon v)-H(y^n+1_k))epsilon simeq -H(y^n+1_k)\
    y^n+1_k+1&=y^n+1_k+v
    endalign

    where the GMRES is used for the second part to find $v$. I don't see why solving for $v$ with GMRES followed by the Newton step should be easier/better than solving the general system in the top for $y^n+1$ using GMRES? Does the finite difference approximation to the Jacobian have better properties compared the the general system $y^n=G(y^n+1,t)$?










    share|cite|improve this question











    $endgroup$














      1












      1








      1





      $begingroup$


      Often when numerically solving nonlinear PDE's using method of lines approach with an implicit integrator a system of nonlinear equations have to be solved.
      To be more specific, let's say we have simple backward Euler method:
      beginalign
      y^n=y^n+1-h f(y^n+1,t)= G(y^n+1,t)
      endalign

      From the available literature, it seems the most common approach is using an Newton-GMRES method to solve the nonlinear system, especially if it is stiff.
      As far as I can understand GMRES is used because it is a matrix-free method and so also works with vector functions which is good when approximating the Jacobian with finite differences.



      My question is then, why not just use the GMRES to solve the initial problem?
      I see no reason why GMRES couldn't solve this for $y^n+1$ when for the Newton-GMRES we solve the system:
      beginalign
      H(y^n+1_k) &= y^n+1_k-y^n-h f(y^n+1_k,t)rightarrow 0 text for krightarrow infty\
      Jv &simeq fracH(y^n+1_k+epsilon v)-H(y^n+1_k))epsilon simeq -H(y^n+1_k)\
      y^n+1_k+1&=y^n+1_k+v
      endalign

      where the GMRES is used for the second part to find $v$. I don't see why solving for $v$ with GMRES followed by the Newton step should be easier/better than solving the general system in the top for $y^n+1$ using GMRES? Does the finite difference approximation to the Jacobian have better properties compared the the general system $y^n=G(y^n+1,t)$?










      share|cite|improve this question











      $endgroup$




      Often when numerically solving nonlinear PDE's using method of lines approach with an implicit integrator a system of nonlinear equations have to be solved.
      To be more specific, let's say we have simple backward Euler method:
      beginalign
      y^n=y^n+1-h f(y^n+1,t)= G(y^n+1,t)
      endalign

      From the available literature, it seems the most common approach is using an Newton-GMRES method to solve the nonlinear system, especially if it is stiff.
      As far as I can understand GMRES is used because it is a matrix-free method and so also works with vector functions which is good when approximating the Jacobian with finite differences.



      My question is then, why not just use the GMRES to solve the initial problem?
      I see no reason why GMRES couldn't solve this for $y^n+1$ when for the Newton-GMRES we solve the system:
      beginalign
      H(y^n+1_k) &= y^n+1_k-y^n-h f(y^n+1_k,t)rightarrow 0 text for krightarrow infty\
      Jv &simeq fracH(y^n+1_k+epsilon v)-H(y^n+1_k))epsilon simeq -H(y^n+1_k)\
      y^n+1_k+1&=y^n+1_k+v
      endalign

      where the GMRES is used for the second part to find $v$. I don't see why solving for $v$ with GMRES followed by the Newton step should be easier/better than solving the general system in the top for $y^n+1$ using GMRES? Does the finite difference approximation to the Jacobian have better properties compared the the general system $y^n=G(y^n+1,t)$?







      pde nonlinear-equations newton-method implicit-methods gmres






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      edited 8 hours ago









      Anton Menshov

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      asked 8 hours ago









      RasmusRasmus

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          1 Answer
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          $begingroup$

          The reason is that GMRES can only be used for solving linear equations, i.e. equations of the form $Ax=b$, where $A$ is some matrix and $x,b$ are vectors. What GMRES does, essentially, is it approximates multiplication by the matrix $A^-1$ using a matrix polynomial of $A$.



          In this case (I assume) $f(y^n+1,t)$ is not necessarily linear in the vector $y^n+1$, and so $y^n=G(y^n+1,t)$ can't be written in the form $y^n=A(t)y^n+1$, where $A(t)$ is a matrix-valued function of time. So you can't use GMRES directly.



          The "Newton step" is actually the formation of the linear system of equations with the Jacobian; the point of Newton's method is that it approximates the solution of a nonlinear equation with the solution of a sequence of linear equations. GMRES is just a tool that is used to implement Newton's method.






          share|cite|improve this answer








          New contributor



          bgav is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.





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            $begingroup$

            The reason is that GMRES can only be used for solving linear equations, i.e. equations of the form $Ax=b$, where $A$ is some matrix and $x,b$ are vectors. What GMRES does, essentially, is it approximates multiplication by the matrix $A^-1$ using a matrix polynomial of $A$.



            In this case (I assume) $f(y^n+1,t)$ is not necessarily linear in the vector $y^n+1$, and so $y^n=G(y^n+1,t)$ can't be written in the form $y^n=A(t)y^n+1$, where $A(t)$ is a matrix-valued function of time. So you can't use GMRES directly.



            The "Newton step" is actually the formation of the linear system of equations with the Jacobian; the point of Newton's method is that it approximates the solution of a nonlinear equation with the solution of a sequence of linear equations. GMRES is just a tool that is used to implement Newton's method.






            share|cite|improve this answer








            New contributor



            bgav is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.





            $endgroup$

















              3












              $begingroup$

              The reason is that GMRES can only be used for solving linear equations, i.e. equations of the form $Ax=b$, where $A$ is some matrix and $x,b$ are vectors. What GMRES does, essentially, is it approximates multiplication by the matrix $A^-1$ using a matrix polynomial of $A$.



              In this case (I assume) $f(y^n+1,t)$ is not necessarily linear in the vector $y^n+1$, and so $y^n=G(y^n+1,t)$ can't be written in the form $y^n=A(t)y^n+1$, where $A(t)$ is a matrix-valued function of time. So you can't use GMRES directly.



              The "Newton step" is actually the formation of the linear system of equations with the Jacobian; the point of Newton's method is that it approximates the solution of a nonlinear equation with the solution of a sequence of linear equations. GMRES is just a tool that is used to implement Newton's method.






              share|cite|improve this answer








              New contributor



              bgav is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
              Check out our Code of Conduct.





              $endgroup$















                3












                3








                3





                $begingroup$

                The reason is that GMRES can only be used for solving linear equations, i.e. equations of the form $Ax=b$, where $A$ is some matrix and $x,b$ are vectors. What GMRES does, essentially, is it approximates multiplication by the matrix $A^-1$ using a matrix polynomial of $A$.



                In this case (I assume) $f(y^n+1,t)$ is not necessarily linear in the vector $y^n+1$, and so $y^n=G(y^n+1,t)$ can't be written in the form $y^n=A(t)y^n+1$, where $A(t)$ is a matrix-valued function of time. So you can't use GMRES directly.



                The "Newton step" is actually the formation of the linear system of equations with the Jacobian; the point of Newton's method is that it approximates the solution of a nonlinear equation with the solution of a sequence of linear equations. GMRES is just a tool that is used to implement Newton's method.






                share|cite|improve this answer








                New contributor



                bgav is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                Check out our Code of Conduct.





                $endgroup$



                The reason is that GMRES can only be used for solving linear equations, i.e. equations of the form $Ax=b$, where $A$ is some matrix and $x,b$ are vectors. What GMRES does, essentially, is it approximates multiplication by the matrix $A^-1$ using a matrix polynomial of $A$.



                In this case (I assume) $f(y^n+1,t)$ is not necessarily linear in the vector $y^n+1$, and so $y^n=G(y^n+1,t)$ can't be written in the form $y^n=A(t)y^n+1$, where $A(t)$ is a matrix-valued function of time. So you can't use GMRES directly.



                The "Newton step" is actually the formation of the linear system of equations with the Jacobian; the point of Newton's method is that it approximates the solution of a nonlinear equation with the solution of a sequence of linear equations. GMRES is just a tool that is used to implement Newton's method.







                share|cite|improve this answer








                New contributor



                bgav is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                Check out our Code of Conduct.








                share|cite|improve this answer



                share|cite|improve this answer






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                answered 7 hours ago









                bgavbgav

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