Turning an Abelian Group into a Vector SpaceAre these vector spaces?Proving a subspace of $mathbbR^2$ is still a vector space with redefined addition / scalar multiplication operations?Define two differents vector space structures over a field on an abelian groupnumber of differents vector space structures over the same field $mathbbF$ on an abelian groupgroups products vs vector space productsCan we define a binary operation on $mathbb Z$ to make it a vector space over $mathbb Q$?Vector spaces: Is (the) scalar multiplication unique?Is a vector space a subset of an abelian group?An abelian group as an $mathbb F_2$-vector spaceCan an abelian group be a real vector space in more than one way?

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Turning an Abelian Group into a Vector Space


Are these vector spaces?Proving a subspace of $mathbbR^2$ is still a vector space with redefined addition / scalar multiplication operations?Define two differents vector space structures over a field on an abelian groupnumber of differents vector space structures over the same field $mathbbF$ on an abelian groupgroups products vs vector space productsCan we define a binary operation on $mathbb Z$ to make it a vector space over $mathbb Q$?Vector spaces: Is (the) scalar multiplication unique?Is a vector space a subset of an abelian group?An abelian group as an $mathbb F_2$-vector spaceCan an abelian group be a real vector space in more than one way?






.everyoneloves__top-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__mid-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__bot-mid-leaderboard:empty margin-bottom:0;








5












$begingroup$


This question is inspired by the question Are these vector spaces? but is free-standing.



Suppose $mathbbF$ is a field, and that $X$ is the multiplicative group of $mathbbF$.



Let us write this abelian group $X$ additively. To be precise the set is $mathbbFsetminus0$, the zero element is $hat0:=1$, the addition operation is $x hat+y:=xy$, and the negative operation is $widehat-x:=x^-1$.



Let $V$ be the abelian group of $n$-tuples $X^n$ with the usual co-ordinatewise operations.



Question : Can we define an $mathbbF$-scalar multiplication on $V$ so that $V$ becomes an $mathbbF$-vector space?



By looking at $-1$ in $mathbbF$, which satisfies $(-1)hat+(-1)=(-1)^2=1=hat0$ we see that if there is to be any chance of turning $V$ into a vector space then the field $mathbbF$ must have characteristic $2$. More than that, a similar argument on $(2^k -1)$-th roots of unity will show that $mathbbF$ has no finite subfields $mathbbF_2^k$ except $mathbbF_2$. Beyond that I cannot go.










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$




















    5












    $begingroup$


    This question is inspired by the question Are these vector spaces? but is free-standing.



    Suppose $mathbbF$ is a field, and that $X$ is the multiplicative group of $mathbbF$.



    Let us write this abelian group $X$ additively. To be precise the set is $mathbbFsetminus0$, the zero element is $hat0:=1$, the addition operation is $x hat+y:=xy$, and the negative operation is $widehat-x:=x^-1$.



    Let $V$ be the abelian group of $n$-tuples $X^n$ with the usual co-ordinatewise operations.



    Question : Can we define an $mathbbF$-scalar multiplication on $V$ so that $V$ becomes an $mathbbF$-vector space?



    By looking at $-1$ in $mathbbF$, which satisfies $(-1)hat+(-1)=(-1)^2=1=hat0$ we see that if there is to be any chance of turning $V$ into a vector space then the field $mathbbF$ must have characteristic $2$. More than that, a similar argument on $(2^k -1)$-th roots of unity will show that $mathbbF$ has no finite subfields $mathbbF_2^k$ except $mathbbF_2$. Beyond that I cannot go.










    share|cite|improve this question











    $endgroup$
















      5












      5








      5


      3



      $begingroup$


      This question is inspired by the question Are these vector spaces? but is free-standing.



      Suppose $mathbbF$ is a field, and that $X$ is the multiplicative group of $mathbbF$.



      Let us write this abelian group $X$ additively. To be precise the set is $mathbbFsetminus0$, the zero element is $hat0:=1$, the addition operation is $x hat+y:=xy$, and the negative operation is $widehat-x:=x^-1$.



      Let $V$ be the abelian group of $n$-tuples $X^n$ with the usual co-ordinatewise operations.



      Question : Can we define an $mathbbF$-scalar multiplication on $V$ so that $V$ becomes an $mathbbF$-vector space?



      By looking at $-1$ in $mathbbF$, which satisfies $(-1)hat+(-1)=(-1)^2=1=hat0$ we see that if there is to be any chance of turning $V$ into a vector space then the field $mathbbF$ must have characteristic $2$. More than that, a similar argument on $(2^k -1)$-th roots of unity will show that $mathbbF$ has no finite subfields $mathbbF_2^k$ except $mathbbF_2$. Beyond that I cannot go.










      share|cite|improve this question











      $endgroup$




      This question is inspired by the question Are these vector spaces? but is free-standing.



      Suppose $mathbbF$ is a field, and that $X$ is the multiplicative group of $mathbbF$.



      Let us write this abelian group $X$ additively. To be precise the set is $mathbbFsetminus0$, the zero element is $hat0:=1$, the addition operation is $x hat+y:=xy$, and the negative operation is $widehat-x:=x^-1$.



      Let $V$ be the abelian group of $n$-tuples $X^n$ with the usual co-ordinatewise operations.



      Question : Can we define an $mathbbF$-scalar multiplication on $V$ so that $V$ becomes an $mathbbF$-vector space?



      By looking at $-1$ in $mathbbF$, which satisfies $(-1)hat+(-1)=(-1)^2=1=hat0$ we see that if there is to be any chance of turning $V$ into a vector space then the field $mathbbF$ must have characteristic $2$. More than that, a similar argument on $(2^k -1)$-th roots of unity will show that $mathbbF$ has no finite subfields $mathbbF_2^k$ except $mathbbF_2$. Beyond that I cannot go.







      linear-algebra abstract-algebra vector-spaces commutative-algebra modules






      share|cite|improve this question















      share|cite|improve this question













      share|cite|improve this question




      share|cite|improve this question








      edited 7 hours ago









      Omnomnomnom

      133k7 gold badges98 silver badges198 bronze badges




      133k7 gold badges98 silver badges198 bronze badges










      asked 8 hours ago









      ancientmathematicianancientmathematician

      5,3971 gold badge6 silver badges17 bronze badges




      5,3971 gold badge6 silver badges17 bronze badges























          2 Answers
          2






          active

          oldest

          votes


















          7













          $begingroup$

          The answer is no except for the trivial case $mathbb F =mathbb F_2$ (in which $V=0$)



          Indeed, assume $mathbb F$ is such a field and take $xin mathbb F^*$. In the structure of $V$, we have $2cdot x = 0$, which translates to $x^2= 1$ in $mathbb F$ (for each coordinate).



          This implies that any element of $mathbb F$ is a root of $X^2-1$ which has at most to roots : $|mathbb F| leq 2$






          share|cite|improve this answer









          $endgroup$














          • $begingroup$
            Fantastic! Any clue what $V otimes Bbb F_2^k$ looks like? Is it ever non-zero?
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            7 hours ago






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            @omnomnomnom : yes, in fact if $mathbb F$ is e.g. $mathbb F_2 (X) $ then its multiplicative group is free, so $Votimes mathbb F$ is a direct sum of copies of $mathbb F$
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            7 hours ago






          • 2




            $begingroup$
            @Omnomnomnom But for $mathbbF_2^k$ and $V=mathbbF_2^ksetminus0$ under multiplication, it is zero: every element of $V$ satisfies $v^2^k=v$, hence the generators are all zero: $votimesalpha = v^2^kotimesalpha = votimes(2^kalpha) = votimes 0 = mathbf0$.
            $endgroup$
            – Arturo Magidin
            7 hours ago










          • $begingroup$
            Great, thanks to both of you
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            6 hours ago






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            @jyrkilahtonen : I think that's the case : the notation $mathbb F$ is used for both
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            6 hours ago


















          0













          $begingroup$

          Not an answer, but hopefully a useful observation. Your question (if I have understood it correctly) can be reframed as follows.




          We are given an abelian group $X = Bbb Fsetminus 0$, which we present as a $Bbb Z$-module where $x+y := xy$ and $nx := x^n$. Is it possible to take $V = X^n$ and extend multiplication by $Bbb Z$ into multiplication by $Bbb F$ in such a way that $V$ becomes a $Bbb F$-module (i.e. a vector space over $Bbb F$)?




          As Max's comment below observes: any $Bbb F$-space structure $V$ exists corresponds to an $Bbb F$-linear map $V otimes_Bbb Z Bbb F to V$. Notably, $V otimes_Bbb Z Bbb F$ is the usual extension of scalars.






          share|cite|improve this answer











          $endgroup$














          • $begingroup$
            Why does $Votimes mathbb F = 0$ ? if it is the case then there is no $mathbb F$-vector space structure on $V$ as such a thing would be a map $Votimes mathbb Fto V$
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            7 hours ago










          • $begingroup$
            @Max I see no justification for my statement, now that I think about it. I'll remove it.
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            7 hours ago













          Your Answer








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          2 Answers
          2






          active

          oldest

          votes








          2 Answers
          2






          active

          oldest

          votes









          active

          oldest

          votes






          active

          oldest

          votes









          7













          $begingroup$

          The answer is no except for the trivial case $mathbb F =mathbb F_2$ (in which $V=0$)



          Indeed, assume $mathbb F$ is such a field and take $xin mathbb F^*$. In the structure of $V$, we have $2cdot x = 0$, which translates to $x^2= 1$ in $mathbb F$ (for each coordinate).



          This implies that any element of $mathbb F$ is a root of $X^2-1$ which has at most to roots : $|mathbb F| leq 2$






          share|cite|improve this answer









          $endgroup$














          • $begingroup$
            Fantastic! Any clue what $V otimes Bbb F_2^k$ looks like? Is it ever non-zero?
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            7 hours ago






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            @omnomnomnom : yes, in fact if $mathbb F$ is e.g. $mathbb F_2 (X) $ then its multiplicative group is free, so $Votimes mathbb F$ is a direct sum of copies of $mathbb F$
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            7 hours ago






          • 2




            $begingroup$
            @Omnomnomnom But for $mathbbF_2^k$ and $V=mathbbF_2^ksetminus0$ under multiplication, it is zero: every element of $V$ satisfies $v^2^k=v$, hence the generators are all zero: $votimesalpha = v^2^kotimesalpha = votimes(2^kalpha) = votimes 0 = mathbf0$.
            $endgroup$
            – Arturo Magidin
            7 hours ago










          • $begingroup$
            Great, thanks to both of you
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            6 hours ago






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            @jyrkilahtonen : I think that's the case : the notation $mathbb F$ is used for both
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            6 hours ago















          7













          $begingroup$

          The answer is no except for the trivial case $mathbb F =mathbb F_2$ (in which $V=0$)



          Indeed, assume $mathbb F$ is such a field and take $xin mathbb F^*$. In the structure of $V$, we have $2cdot x = 0$, which translates to $x^2= 1$ in $mathbb F$ (for each coordinate).



          This implies that any element of $mathbb F$ is a root of $X^2-1$ which has at most to roots : $|mathbb F| leq 2$






          share|cite|improve this answer









          $endgroup$














          • $begingroup$
            Fantastic! Any clue what $V otimes Bbb F_2^k$ looks like? Is it ever non-zero?
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            7 hours ago






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            @omnomnomnom : yes, in fact if $mathbb F$ is e.g. $mathbb F_2 (X) $ then its multiplicative group is free, so $Votimes mathbb F$ is a direct sum of copies of $mathbb F$
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            7 hours ago






          • 2




            $begingroup$
            @Omnomnomnom But for $mathbbF_2^k$ and $V=mathbbF_2^ksetminus0$ under multiplication, it is zero: every element of $V$ satisfies $v^2^k=v$, hence the generators are all zero: $votimesalpha = v^2^kotimesalpha = votimes(2^kalpha) = votimes 0 = mathbf0$.
            $endgroup$
            – Arturo Magidin
            7 hours ago










          • $begingroup$
            Great, thanks to both of you
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            6 hours ago






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            @jyrkilahtonen : I think that's the case : the notation $mathbb F$ is used for both
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            6 hours ago













          7














          7










          7







          $begingroup$

          The answer is no except for the trivial case $mathbb F =mathbb F_2$ (in which $V=0$)



          Indeed, assume $mathbb F$ is such a field and take $xin mathbb F^*$. In the structure of $V$, we have $2cdot x = 0$, which translates to $x^2= 1$ in $mathbb F$ (for each coordinate).



          This implies that any element of $mathbb F$ is a root of $X^2-1$ which has at most to roots : $|mathbb F| leq 2$






          share|cite|improve this answer









          $endgroup$



          The answer is no except for the trivial case $mathbb F =mathbb F_2$ (in which $V=0$)



          Indeed, assume $mathbb F$ is such a field and take $xin mathbb F^*$. In the structure of $V$, we have $2cdot x = 0$, which translates to $x^2= 1$ in $mathbb F$ (for each coordinate).



          This implies that any element of $mathbb F$ is a root of $X^2-1$ which has at most to roots : $|mathbb F| leq 2$







          share|cite|improve this answer












          share|cite|improve this answer



          share|cite|improve this answer










          answered 7 hours ago









          MaxMax

          23.2k1 gold badge12 silver badges54 bronze badges




          23.2k1 gold badge12 silver badges54 bronze badges














          • $begingroup$
            Fantastic! Any clue what $V otimes Bbb F_2^k$ looks like? Is it ever non-zero?
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            7 hours ago






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            @omnomnomnom : yes, in fact if $mathbb F$ is e.g. $mathbb F_2 (X) $ then its multiplicative group is free, so $Votimes mathbb F$ is a direct sum of copies of $mathbb F$
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            7 hours ago






          • 2




            $begingroup$
            @Omnomnomnom But for $mathbbF_2^k$ and $V=mathbbF_2^ksetminus0$ under multiplication, it is zero: every element of $V$ satisfies $v^2^k=v$, hence the generators are all zero: $votimesalpha = v^2^kotimesalpha = votimes(2^kalpha) = votimes 0 = mathbf0$.
            $endgroup$
            – Arturo Magidin
            7 hours ago










          • $begingroup$
            Great, thanks to both of you
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            6 hours ago






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            @jyrkilahtonen : I think that's the case : the notation $mathbb F$ is used for both
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            6 hours ago
















          • $begingroup$
            Fantastic! Any clue what $V otimes Bbb F_2^k$ looks like? Is it ever non-zero?
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            7 hours ago






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            @omnomnomnom : yes, in fact if $mathbb F$ is e.g. $mathbb F_2 (X) $ then its multiplicative group is free, so $Votimes mathbb F$ is a direct sum of copies of $mathbb F$
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            7 hours ago






          • 2




            $begingroup$
            @Omnomnomnom But for $mathbbF_2^k$ and $V=mathbbF_2^ksetminus0$ under multiplication, it is zero: every element of $V$ satisfies $v^2^k=v$, hence the generators are all zero: $votimesalpha = v^2^kotimesalpha = votimes(2^kalpha) = votimes 0 = mathbf0$.
            $endgroup$
            – Arturo Magidin
            7 hours ago










          • $begingroup$
            Great, thanks to both of you
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            6 hours ago






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            @jyrkilahtonen : I think that's the case : the notation $mathbb F$ is used for both
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            6 hours ago















          $begingroup$
          Fantastic! Any clue what $V otimes Bbb F_2^k$ looks like? Is it ever non-zero?
          $endgroup$
          – Omnomnomnom
          7 hours ago




          $begingroup$
          Fantastic! Any clue what $V otimes Bbb F_2^k$ looks like? Is it ever non-zero?
          $endgroup$
          – Omnomnomnom
          7 hours ago




          1




          1




          $begingroup$
          @omnomnomnom : yes, in fact if $mathbb F$ is e.g. $mathbb F_2 (X) $ then its multiplicative group is free, so $Votimes mathbb F$ is a direct sum of copies of $mathbb F$
          $endgroup$
          – Max
          7 hours ago




          $begingroup$
          @omnomnomnom : yes, in fact if $mathbb F$ is e.g. $mathbb F_2 (X) $ then its multiplicative group is free, so $Votimes mathbb F$ is a direct sum of copies of $mathbb F$
          $endgroup$
          – Max
          7 hours ago




          2




          2




          $begingroup$
          @Omnomnomnom But for $mathbbF_2^k$ and $V=mathbbF_2^ksetminus0$ under multiplication, it is zero: every element of $V$ satisfies $v^2^k=v$, hence the generators are all zero: $votimesalpha = v^2^kotimesalpha = votimes(2^kalpha) = votimes 0 = mathbf0$.
          $endgroup$
          – Arturo Magidin
          7 hours ago




          $begingroup$
          @Omnomnomnom But for $mathbbF_2^k$ and $V=mathbbF_2^ksetminus0$ under multiplication, it is zero: every element of $V$ satisfies $v^2^k=v$, hence the generators are all zero: $votimesalpha = v^2^kotimesalpha = votimes(2^kalpha) = votimes 0 = mathbf0$.
          $endgroup$
          – Arturo Magidin
          7 hours ago












          $begingroup$
          Great, thanks to both of you
          $endgroup$
          – Omnomnomnom
          6 hours ago




          $begingroup$
          Great, thanks to both of you
          $endgroup$
          – Omnomnomnom
          6 hours ago




          1




          1




          $begingroup$
          @jyrkilahtonen : I think that's the case : the notation $mathbb F$ is used for both
          $endgroup$
          – Max
          6 hours ago




          $begingroup$
          @jyrkilahtonen : I think that's the case : the notation $mathbb F$ is used for both
          $endgroup$
          – Max
          6 hours ago













          0













          $begingroup$

          Not an answer, but hopefully a useful observation. Your question (if I have understood it correctly) can be reframed as follows.




          We are given an abelian group $X = Bbb Fsetminus 0$, which we present as a $Bbb Z$-module where $x+y := xy$ and $nx := x^n$. Is it possible to take $V = X^n$ and extend multiplication by $Bbb Z$ into multiplication by $Bbb F$ in such a way that $V$ becomes a $Bbb F$-module (i.e. a vector space over $Bbb F$)?




          As Max's comment below observes: any $Bbb F$-space structure $V$ exists corresponds to an $Bbb F$-linear map $V otimes_Bbb Z Bbb F to V$. Notably, $V otimes_Bbb Z Bbb F$ is the usual extension of scalars.






          share|cite|improve this answer











          $endgroup$














          • $begingroup$
            Why does $Votimes mathbb F = 0$ ? if it is the case then there is no $mathbb F$-vector space structure on $V$ as such a thing would be a map $Votimes mathbb Fto V$
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            7 hours ago










          • $begingroup$
            @Max I see no justification for my statement, now that I think about it. I'll remove it.
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            7 hours ago















          0













          $begingroup$

          Not an answer, but hopefully a useful observation. Your question (if I have understood it correctly) can be reframed as follows.




          We are given an abelian group $X = Bbb Fsetminus 0$, which we present as a $Bbb Z$-module where $x+y := xy$ and $nx := x^n$. Is it possible to take $V = X^n$ and extend multiplication by $Bbb Z$ into multiplication by $Bbb F$ in such a way that $V$ becomes a $Bbb F$-module (i.e. a vector space over $Bbb F$)?




          As Max's comment below observes: any $Bbb F$-space structure $V$ exists corresponds to an $Bbb F$-linear map $V otimes_Bbb Z Bbb F to V$. Notably, $V otimes_Bbb Z Bbb F$ is the usual extension of scalars.






          share|cite|improve this answer











          $endgroup$














          • $begingroup$
            Why does $Votimes mathbb F = 0$ ? if it is the case then there is no $mathbb F$-vector space structure on $V$ as such a thing would be a map $Votimes mathbb Fto V$
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            7 hours ago










          • $begingroup$
            @Max I see no justification for my statement, now that I think about it. I'll remove it.
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            7 hours ago













          0














          0










          0







          $begingroup$

          Not an answer, but hopefully a useful observation. Your question (if I have understood it correctly) can be reframed as follows.




          We are given an abelian group $X = Bbb Fsetminus 0$, which we present as a $Bbb Z$-module where $x+y := xy$ and $nx := x^n$. Is it possible to take $V = X^n$ and extend multiplication by $Bbb Z$ into multiplication by $Bbb F$ in such a way that $V$ becomes a $Bbb F$-module (i.e. a vector space over $Bbb F$)?




          As Max's comment below observes: any $Bbb F$-space structure $V$ exists corresponds to an $Bbb F$-linear map $V otimes_Bbb Z Bbb F to V$. Notably, $V otimes_Bbb Z Bbb F$ is the usual extension of scalars.






          share|cite|improve this answer











          $endgroup$



          Not an answer, but hopefully a useful observation. Your question (if I have understood it correctly) can be reframed as follows.




          We are given an abelian group $X = Bbb Fsetminus 0$, which we present as a $Bbb Z$-module where $x+y := xy$ and $nx := x^n$. Is it possible to take $V = X^n$ and extend multiplication by $Bbb Z$ into multiplication by $Bbb F$ in such a way that $V$ becomes a $Bbb F$-module (i.e. a vector space over $Bbb F$)?




          As Max's comment below observes: any $Bbb F$-space structure $V$ exists corresponds to an $Bbb F$-linear map $V otimes_Bbb Z Bbb F to V$. Notably, $V otimes_Bbb Z Bbb F$ is the usual extension of scalars.







          share|cite|improve this answer














          share|cite|improve this answer



          share|cite|improve this answer








          edited 7 hours ago


























          community wiki





          3 revs
          Omnomnomnom















          • $begingroup$
            Why does $Votimes mathbb F = 0$ ? if it is the case then there is no $mathbb F$-vector space structure on $V$ as such a thing would be a map $Votimes mathbb Fto V$
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            7 hours ago










          • $begingroup$
            @Max I see no justification for my statement, now that I think about it. I'll remove it.
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            7 hours ago
















          • $begingroup$
            Why does $Votimes mathbb F = 0$ ? if it is the case then there is no $mathbb F$-vector space structure on $V$ as such a thing would be a map $Votimes mathbb Fto V$
            $endgroup$
            – Max
            7 hours ago










          • $begingroup$
            @Max I see no justification for my statement, now that I think about it. I'll remove it.
            $endgroup$
            – Omnomnomnom
            7 hours ago















          $begingroup$
          Why does $Votimes mathbb F = 0$ ? if it is the case then there is no $mathbb F$-vector space structure on $V$ as such a thing would be a map $Votimes mathbb Fto V$
          $endgroup$
          – Max
          7 hours ago




          $begingroup$
          Why does $Votimes mathbb F = 0$ ? if it is the case then there is no $mathbb F$-vector space structure on $V$ as such a thing would be a map $Votimes mathbb Fto V$
          $endgroup$
          – Max
          7 hours ago












          $begingroup$
          @Max I see no justification for my statement, now that I think about it. I'll remove it.
          $endgroup$
          – Omnomnomnom
          7 hours ago




          $begingroup$
          @Max I see no justification for my statement, now that I think about it. I'll remove it.
          $endgroup$
          – Omnomnomnom
          7 hours ago

















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